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I've seen/read probably about 6 or 7 different studies on UBI from trials in many different countries and in the medium to long term they have all been deemed as a failure. It is always one of those things that appears to be a good idea in theory.
I've seen/read probably about 6 or 7 different studies on UBI from trials in many different countries and in the medium to long term they have all been deemed as a failure. It is always one of those things that appears to be a good idea in theory.
Same here. If it was really a success some countries would have taken it past the experimental stage and fully implemented it by now.
Doesn't come across as a complete flop in this article.
I do think introducing it on a temporary basis would have helped combat the pandemic. How many people on zeros hours contracts and or no sick pay have gone to work with Covid-19 symptoms because they couldn't afford not to. Yes some will have taken the mickey but I'd say the vast majority would not.
Haven’t we just had this for businesses?. Over 60% taking the furlough money off the govt made their employees carry on working. Free money for businesses yeah
Edit. Not meant as a reply to you, just a general point!
Haven’t we just had this for businesses?. Over 60% taking the furlough money off the govt made their employees carry on working. Free money for businesses yeah
Edit. Not meant as a reply to you, just a general point!
[Post edited 25 Aug 2020 12:21]
Bit like the money the banks got to stimulate the economy. Which they used to buy their own shares, increasing the share price and in turn increasing directors bonuses but of course #greedisgood
'Only happy when you've got it often makes you miss the journey'
Doesn't come across as a complete flop in this article.
I do think introducing it on a temporary basis would have helped combat the pandemic. How many people on zeros hours contracts and or no sick pay have gone to work with Covid-19 symptoms because they couldn't afford not to. Yes some will have taken the mickey but I'd say the vast majority would not.
You make a really good point about people working with Covid-19 symptons as they cannot afford not to work. Although you do not need UBI to tackle this, a temporary enhancement to sick pay eligiblity and provision would work in this case.
Looking at the article you linked to neither the Alaska example or the one proposed in Spain would be classed as UBI in its truest sense. In Alaska it is a once a year profit share from oil revenues, which is a good idea. In the Spanish example the additional link to
indicates that the proposed (not yet implemented) scheme would affect up to 1 million familes and would provide them a 'guaranteed montly income for poorer Spaniards'. To take a direct quote from the article 'The amount of money each eligible family receives will be adjusted according to household income as well as a review of total assets'. To me this similar to what we have in the UK at the moment in the form of Universal Credit and not a true UBI as it is means tested. Now whether this works, is to a high enough level is a mute point and will depend on a number of perspectives.
I've seen the Kenya, Indian and more widely the Finnish examples before. As with the vast majority of these studies they are limited in scope and time. As I posted earlier there have been some limited short term benefits for the trial groups, but these trials have never been extended either the duration, with the same 'trial group' or with a wider scope.
The main economic arguments against a UBI always come down to cost and disincentives to be economically active. I would also question what is the correct level of UBI and why should someone who does not need it be given a monthly UBI payment of say £1,500 a month? Over a certain income the paradox of thrift overrides the trickle down and money flow benefits of UBI.
Rather than UBI would a different question be should there be a set minimum that the welfare system provides and what level should that be? Should there be any caveats placed on entitlement to such a system, especially for those who are able to work?
If you look at some of the much vaunted Scandinavian models of welfare for people who have paid in to the system but lost their job their receive enhanced benefits for a year to give them time to find a suitable job. After that year the amount they recieve falls to a lower level. Those who are able to work, but have not paid in they recieve the lower amount.
Bit like the money the banks got to stimulate the economy. Which they used to buy their own shares, increasing the share price and in turn increasing directors bonuses but of course #greedisgood
60%, where have you got that figure from? Edit: Was meant to be a reply to Riddler.
Sorry, reply should have been to RR who’s claiming 60% of companies are breaking the law by forcing employees to work while being furloughed, I’d just like to know where his 60% figure comes from.
Bit like the money the banks got to stimulate the economy. Which they used to buy their own shares, increasing the share price and in turn increasing directors bonuses but of course #greedisgood
Except, this is money meant to go directly to employees, which makes it completely different.
Sorry, reply should have been to RR who’s claiming 60% of companies are breaking the law by forcing employees to work while being furloughed, I’d just like to know where his 60% figure comes from.
A report in the Daily Telegraph. Also the sun reporting over 30,000 firms being investigated . 25,000 claims stopped as the firms weren’t trading or had no employees.
A report in the Daily Telegraph. Also the sun reporting over 30,000 firms being investigated . 25,000 claims stopped as the firms weren’t trading or had no employees.
I’m struggling to find these figures so if anyone can post a link it would be much appreciated. I do hope though, that any companies found to be fiddling the furlough system are caught and held accountable for their actions and deal with accordingly.
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