| Release clauses in contracts 13:51 - Jan 10 with 6461 views | D_Alien |
We know that Dale are willing to accept them, in order to attract the type of talent that's kept us afloat not just in L1 but financially; and then to retain them on contracts such as Ollie Rathbone's 3 year deal
Of course i don't know for certain, but what's the point in getting angsty about whether we'll accept £X for whoever when it's probably a given that they'll leave (if they want to) once a certain amount is on offer?
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 13:52]
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| Release clauses in contracts on 11:23 - Jan 11 with 2020 views | tony_roch975 |
| Release clauses in contracts on 20:15 - Jan 10 by 49thseason |
All true but the sell on clause still reflects value at the start of the contract when no one can be sure how well the player will perform, three transfer windows later a players value might still be much greater than initially thought. So the sliding scale can still apply . If the player has not lived up to expectations the contract would not have escalated his value and he could leave for free. If however a good offer does come in before the end of the contract, the sliding scale applies and the fee is appropriate to his performances for the club. Its entirely possible that a player signing a first contract could play 90 -100 games within a 2 year contract period, the club deserves a reward that is consistent with that opportunity. Additionally, there is now a basis for a negotiation on a transfer fee, down from the contracted amount, if required to get a deal done. But at least the starting point is an agreed reflection of current value, not an arbitrary figure set on day one of the contract which may be derisory 2 years down the road.
The problem of players leaving the club for nothing at the end of a contract is an altogether different discussion... Mendez-Laing being a notable example. |
Apologies if I've misunderstood your idea but if there's a sliding scale the very attraction to potential signees of Dale offering a low release clause would be removed so they possibly wouldn't sign. |  |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 11:43 - Jan 11 with 1975 views | fitzochris |
| Release clauses in contracts on 16:54 - Jan 10 by tony_roch975 |
exactly - Lambert was I believe the first add-ons sale (well done Colin Garlick), we "didn't have a history" of doing it so players & their agents hadn't sussed out pushing us for a low release clause - now they have. |
I’m not disputing when the sell-on clauses came into play, nor the necessity of a minimum-release fee clause. My point was that when the latter clause is agreed, it cannot be to favour the player at the expense of the club.
I disputed your point about players only wanting to sign for us because they have nowhere else to go. I don’t think that’s the case. Many a player has told me they saw their move to us as a positive step. They certainly didn’t feel we were a last resort.
I’ve also posted here before about the informal arrangement that we have with our youth players regarding two years in the first team before being allowed to move up the football food chain. That was the case when Chris Dunphy was chairman, at any rate. |  |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 13:29 - Jan 11 with 1908 views | 49thseason |
| Release clauses in contracts on 11:23 - Jan 11 by tony_roch975 |
Apologies if I've misunderstood your idea but if there's a sliding scale the very attraction to potential signees of Dale offering a low release clause would be removed so they possibly wouldn't sign. |
Again, probably correct but I rather think the biggest hurdle for young players is to get into the shop window in the first place. A chance to play 1st team football at 16 or 17 is rare ... hence Baah turns up at Spotland. I doubt he or his agent will worry too much about the end of the contract until he has proved to the world that he is worth buying. If everyone knows what the score is, then the club can always do something different if they want to but it keeps the guts of the negotiation in their hands, not the buying clubs. |  | | |
| Release clauses in contracts on 17:39 - Jan 11 with 1824 views | tony_roch975 |
| Release clauses in contracts on 13:29 - Jan 11 by 49thseason |
Again, probably correct but I rather think the biggest hurdle for young players is to get into the shop window in the first place. A chance to play 1st team football at 16 or 17 is rare ... hence Baah turns up at Spotland. I doubt he or his agent will worry too much about the end of the contract until he has proved to the world that he is worth buying. If everyone knows what the score is, then the club can always do something different if they want to but it keeps the guts of the negotiation in their hands, not the buying clubs. |
agree with that - it's a case of balancing the pros & cons; we get an exciting prospect at the start of their career, they get rare 1st team experience ('shop-window' time) and we agree to let them go when their release clause is met | |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 22:15 - Jan 11 with 1747 views | macro |
| Release clauses in contracts on 16:00 - Jan 10 by fitzochris |
Would they? Nobody knew who Holt was before he started scoring goals for us. Same goes for most others.
I think to paint a picture of us being some kind of last resort is a little unfair.
Yes, we are a small fish in the four professional divisions, but players don't sign for us with one arm bent up their back. |
In fact some players in particularly younger players know they will be given a chance at Dale which makes us more attractive. The salary side of thing will naturally be a draw back but this isn't the Dale of the 80s and 90s |  | | |
| Release clauses in contracts on 23:00 - Jan 11 with 1678 views | Thacks_Rabbits |
| Release clauses in contracts on 22:15 - Jan 11 by macro |
In fact some players in particularly younger players know they will be given a chance at Dale which makes us more attractive. The salary side of thing will naturally be a draw back but this isn't the Dale of the 80s and 90s |
I think the key thing in our contracts is the necessity to get the contract extension signed, I obviously don’t know the finer details, but if part of the release clause is a sell on, in black and white, then it’s probably good for both player, agent and club.
The agent still gets his percentage, the player gets what he wants and we get a lump sum and maybe 40% of future profits. The key thing is a future sell on does not massively effect the agent or player, only the buying club.
On another note I think Luke is potentially the best player we have ever had, mk got 5 million for dele, I see Luke as a 2.5 million quid player, but I really hope whoever comes in for him allows him to stay here and finish his education on and off the pitch! |  |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 23:07 - Jan 11 with 1659 views | D_Alien |
| Release clauses in contracts on 23:00 - Jan 11 by Thacks_Rabbits |
I think the key thing in our contracts is the necessity to get the contract extension signed, I obviously don’t know the finer details, but if part of the release clause is a sell on, in black and white, then it’s probably good for both player, agent and club.
The agent still gets his percentage, the player gets what he wants and we get a lump sum and maybe 40% of future profits. The key thing is a future sell on does not massively effect the agent or player, only the buying club.
On another note I think Luke is potentially the best player we have ever had, mk got 5 million for dele, I see Luke as a 2.5 million quid player, but I really hope whoever comes in for him allows him to stay here and finish his education on and off the pitch! |
That last point is very important
Luke's obviously a keen scholar; he and his family wouldn't want to see any disruption to his education until he's completed his A-levels, so he either stops at Dale (even if its loaned back) or signs for a very local club until that happens | |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 23:20 - Jan 11 with 1619 views | Thacks_Rabbits |
| Release clauses in contracts on 23:07 - Jan 11 by D_Alien |
That last point is very important
Luke's obviously a keen scholar; he and his family wouldn't want to see any disruption to his education until he's completed his A-levels, so he either stops at Dale (even if its loaned back) or signs for a very local club until that happens |
I hope so DA though if he gets offered 5k a week on a 4 year deal it may be a difficult choice for the lad. | |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 23:27 - Jan 11 with 1608 views | 49thseason |
| Release clauses in contracts on 23:20 - Jan 11 by Thacks_Rabbits |
I hope so DA though if he gets offered 5k a week on a 4 year deal it may be a difficult choice for the lad. |
So let's see, you can earn £1m over the next 4 years or take your A levels... you would have to be mad not to take the money. Even if it all ends in tears he would be massively better off and could afford to take a couple of years out to finish his studies at his own expense and still have more money than most people could dream of and he would still only be 21 or 22 years old! | | | |
| Release clauses in contracts on 23:30 - Jan 11 with 1602 views | Thacks_Rabbits |
| Release clauses in contracts on 23:27 - Jan 11 by 49thseason |
So let's see, you can earn £1m over the next 4 years or take your A levels... you would have to be mad not to take the money. Even if it all ends in tears he would be massively better off and could afford to take a couple of years out to finish his studies at his own expense and still have more money than most people could dream of and he would still only be 21 or 22 years old! |
That was my point 49th | |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 00:00 - Jan 12 with 1560 views | D_Alien |
| Release clauses in contracts on 23:27 - Jan 11 by 49thseason |
So let's see, you can earn £1m over the next 4 years or take your A levels... you would have to be mad not to take the money. Even if it all ends in tears he would be massively better off and could afford to take a couple of years out to finish his studies at his own expense and still have more money than most people could dream of and he would still only be 21 or 22 years old! |
I very much doubt it'd be as simple to return to studying as you make out
Plus, these days, £1m minus taxes doesn't go anywhere near setting you up for life. It's a tempter, but being settled and happy is priceless | |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 02:04 - Jan 12 with 1509 views | 49thseason |
| Release clauses in contracts on 00:00 - Jan 12 by D_Alien |
I very much doubt it'd be as simple to return to studying as you make out
Plus, these days, £1m minus taxes doesn't go anywhere near setting you up for life. It's a tempter, but being settled and happy is priceless |
He could take his A levels anywhere he likes free of charge up to being 25 years old. Or he could do a university Access course at any age. He might complete his A Levels in the next 12 months and then start an OU course at 18 if he wanted to continue his education and play football at the same time. I imagine the FA also support players who want to continue studying. | | | |
| Release clauses in contracts on 05:00 - Jan 12 with 1471 views | D_Alien |
| Release clauses in contracts on 02:04 - Jan 12 by 49thseason |
He could take his A levels anywhere he likes free of charge up to being 25 years old. Or he could do a university Access course at any age. He might complete his A Levels in the next 12 months and then start an OU course at 18 if he wanted to continue his education and play football at the same time. I imagine the FA also support players who want to continue studying. |
Or he could simply complete his A-levels on the same track he's on now
One of his subjects being Psychology, I think he'll understand the value of that and not disrupt his pre-degree level education to go chasing a quick buck as you suggest he might, knowing that continuity and the supportive environment of his friends and family count for more at his age than scurrying off and losing that vital benefit
Of course you can study anywhere, at anytime, once you've established that baseline up to 18,'which is what we're talking about here
[Post edited 12 Jan 2020 5:04]
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| Release clauses in contracts on 10:43 - Jan 12 with 1339 views | kiwidale |
| Release clauses in contracts on 00:00 - Jan 12 by D_Alien |
I very much doubt it'd be as simple to return to studying as you make out
Plus, these days, £1m minus taxes doesn't go anywhere near setting you up for life. It's a tempter, but being settled and happy is priceless |
To put it in perspective one million pounds over 4 years less taxes is a massive amount of money esp in a town like Rochdale. It took me 40 years to pay off a mortgage albeit over several different properties, if I sold now I might scrape the equivalent of 750 thousand pounds and my total assets after a lifetime is a lot less than a million quid. [Post edited 12 Jan 2020 11:04]
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| This is not the time for bickering.
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| Release clauses in contracts on 11:10 - Jan 12 with 1287 views | D_Alien |
| Release clauses in contracts on 10:43 - Jan 12 by kiwidale |
To put it in perspective one million pounds over 4 years less taxes is a massive amount of money esp in a town like Rochdale. It took me 40 years to pay off a mortgage albeit over several different properties, if I sold now I might scrape the equivalent of 750 thousand pounds and my total assets after a lifetime is a lot less than a million quid. [Post edited 12 Jan 2020 11:04]
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But then again kiwi, you've no chance of getting an A-level in Psychology either | |
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| Release clauses in contracts on 13:50 - Jan 12 with 1182 views | nordenblue |
| Release clauses in contracts on 02:04 - Jan 12 by 49thseason |
He could take his A levels anywhere he likes free of charge up to being 25 years old. Or he could do a university Access course at any age. He might complete his A Levels in the next 12 months and then start an OU course at 18 if he wanted to continue his education and play football at the same time. I imagine the FA also support players who want to continue studying. |
The FA pays for players to study at any age,to continue a career once the football ends, [Post edited 12 Jan 2020 13:53]
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| Release clauses in contracts on 13:54 - Jan 12 with 1169 views | frenzied |
If an opportunity comes up for him he should grab it with both hands whilst his stock value is high..an injury or an average next season and he’s off the radar.. | | | |
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