| Staring Down The Barrel on 14:54 - Dec 14 with 5146 views | 442Dale |
Good article with some pertinent points made and questions raised. Reflects the mood of a lot of the fan base I’d think. |  |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 16:18 - Dec 14 with 4992 views | HullDale |
Its a really good article, and one that starts a conversation about the enormity of the task ahead of us in the next 6 months.
The issues with the squad / playing staff are well documented, and have been debated to death... unusually it feels like the vast majority of the support are in agreement on it.
The challenges around commercial performance and senior decisions is an interesting one, though. The BoD, alongside Trust & fans, deserve all the praise in the world for saving us over the last 18 months. However, I think as business people the new board would also be open to / accepting of constructive criticism that should serve to help drive us forward off the pitch - raising money to spend on it.
I'm not talking about the tit for tat, personal insults that get thrown about on social media by mates of Bottomley, mates of people who used to work at the club, or friends / parents of those daft enough to get banning orders... I'm talking about serious questions about various aspects of performance.
- The aesthetic touches are mentioned in the article... the new signage / studds / main entrance look great, but (a) how was that paid for and (b) are we yet seeing an RoI on them? Does new signage equal more custom immediately, or how are we monitoring when the cost has at least broken even?
- We now have three full time commercial people. There have been shoots of recovery with sponsorship looking at new signs etc, but are we yet breaking even on their salaries and outgoings? Lots of player sponsorships remain blank, hospitality is seemingly never full, and weekend usage of the function rooms seems sparse at best. Things like England games etc will take time to become a habit, the fanzone probably depends on results (although its not really thought through if there is a function that evening in the Ratcliffe), but I'd expect to be seeing function / event space / meeting bookings escalating pretty quickly now.
- The club shop is still sparse at best, and there isn't loads of innovation in there. There are plenty of companies who supply branded / personalised gear for low upfront cost with a % then taken at point of sale... surely we should be looking forward at that and giving people more reasons to go into the shop and have a look. 75% of a sale of something is better than 100% of a sale of nothing. We coild even explore endless aisle opportunities and become a sports retailer in the town rather than just selling Dale merch.
- Simple things like a bottle / can bar in Studds at half time, and maybe in Dale bar too, can only help. Although the tilling system has improved, service is ropey at best and can put people off even trying the following week.
- Communication / Press Output has been almost non-existent over the last few weeks. What updates have we seen about the work going in to rectify the Harrogate game other than a group gym photo on Saturday? Communication is key, especially at a time that we have an active share issue and a disconnect between the fanbase and first team.
This absolutely is not a criticism of the board as a whole, and I believe how much work is going on behind the scenes to get the basics right after the circus of the last regime, but we need to be helping them to hold the people responsible for all of the above to account. If the rumours about money being tight are true, in the midst of a cost of living crisis, then we need to give Joe Public a reason to spend at Spotland rather than anywhere else. |  | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 17:19 - Dec 14 with 4843 views | foreverhopefulDale |
That is an excellent article. Seems a very accurate accessment of what went on and the players. This might be controversial to say, but if we did get relegated but won more than we lost, and played decent football, it wouldn't be too bad, of course we all want to stay in the FL, however if we were to languishing near the bottom, losing like we are now more often than not, maybe it would be better in the league below but with more entertaining football and better results. Of course we might be able to go back to competing near the top and get back into League 1, however it would need a good manager with funds for building a squad with some youth coming through like what happened with Hill. |  |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 17:24 - Dec 14 with 4834 views | blackdogblue |
Great article & sums up a lot of what people are thinking / saying ðŸ‘
One point I will say is in regards to the new Radcliffe Arms sign…. Did we run out of money or is the “Arms” bit on back order 🤷â€â™‚ï¸ |  |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:02 - Dec 14 with 4531 views | 49thseason |
this new facility at Accrington is very impressive
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:18 - Dec 14 with 4473 views | 442Dale |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:02 - Dec 14 by 49thseason |
this new facility at Accrington is very impressive
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He seems to be raging about locals/the council moaning about noise from the events they put on.
It is an excellent facility though.
Back to Dale, there needs to be visible change to how the club runs - as mentioned in other posts - any fan should be able to answer “what’s different?” to every part of the club’s off the field operations.
It’s the basics that tell a story. That we haven’t even trialled a cash turnstile is one. That the OS/twitter doesn’t advertise a daily product available in the club shop in the run up to Christmas is another. | |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:21 - Dec 14 with 4467 views | 49thseason |
I suspect, with the best will in the world, new ideas and energy are going to have to come from the fanbase, The Board all have their own businesses to look after so the amount of time available to do the "Managing by walking about " thing is probably fairly limited, and as to providing what the fans want, how will they ever know if we don't tell them and get them to listen?
As I said after the AGM, an army of fans may well still be something that is needed , but someone has to take the lead... I guess it may fall to the fans to make the offer as there has nothing tangible happened since the AGM....... | | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:27 - Dec 14 with 4453 views | HullDale |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:18 - Dec 14 by 442Dale |
He seems to be raging about locals/the council moaning about noise from the events they put on.
It is an excellent facility though.
Back to Dale, there needs to be visible change to how the club runs - as mentioned in other posts - any fan should be able to answer “what’s different?” to every part of the club’s off the field operations.
It’s the basics that tell a story. That we haven’t even trialled a cash turnstile is one. That the OS/twitter doesn’t advertise a daily product available in the club shop in the run up to Christmas is another. |
I was chatting to ATP earlier, & when you look at our media output in c.2 weeks since the Harrogate shocker its:
Frost Covers
Toy Appeal
Lotto
TVOS
Scoreboard Vacancy
Barrow Tickets
Postponement
Danny Lloyd
England v France
Sellebrity Match
Food Week
Food Week
Opening Hours
Lotto
Womens Networking
The latest video on our YouTube channel is still the Harrogate highlights.
No Xmas gift ideas, no Xmas ticket bundle, no video interview with the new guy, no engagement with managers or players. Under previous regimes we would've been raging about stuff like that &, although we should remain constructive, we shouldn't let these things slide. Players seemingly on holiday on social media just adds to the frustration.
Again, if rumours about cashflow are true, why is there no Xmas draw this year? A money spinner and a chance to engage with the wider town, and advertise something more relevant on our own hoardings than season tickets which went off sale ages ago.
There is a fanbase that feels closer to the club than ever before after the last 18 months - although we are years away from facilities like Accy, we need to be working harder than ever and sweating the assets we do have to survive. [Post edited 14 Dec 2022 20:29]
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:51 - Dec 14 with 4383 views | 442Dale |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:27 - Dec 14 by HullDale |
I was chatting to ATP earlier, & when you look at our media output in c.2 weeks since the Harrogate shocker its:
Frost Covers
Toy Appeal
Lotto
TVOS
Scoreboard Vacancy
Barrow Tickets
Postponement
Danny Lloyd
England v France
Sellebrity Match
Food Week
Food Week
Opening Hours
Lotto
Womens Networking
The latest video on our YouTube channel is still the Harrogate highlights.
No Xmas gift ideas, no Xmas ticket bundle, no video interview with the new guy, no engagement with managers or players. Under previous regimes we would've been raging about stuff like that &, although we should remain constructive, we shouldn't let these things slide. Players seemingly on holiday on social media just adds to the frustration.
Again, if rumours about cashflow are true, why is there no Xmas draw this year? A money spinner and a chance to engage with the wider town, and advertise something more relevant on our own hoardings than season tickets which went off sale ages ago.
There is a fanbase that feels closer to the club than ever before after the last 18 months - although we are years away from facilities like Accy, we need to be working harder than ever and sweating the assets we do have to survive. [Post edited 14 Dec 2022 20:29]
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Under previous regimes, going back two decades, fans became so disillusioned by pointing out the bleeding obvious that apathy replaced any rage. The points you’ve raised could and would have been posted in here over the last 15 years, so again, what’s different? That’s what needs to be focused on.
That ‘volunteer army’, an excellent idea put forward at the AGM, what’s happened with creating a structure for it to exist effectively? | |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 21:00 - Dec 14 with 4367 views | D_Alien |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:21 - Dec 14 by 49thseason |
I suspect, with the best will in the world, new ideas and energy are going to have to come from the fanbase, The Board all have their own businesses to look after so the amount of time available to do the "Managing by walking about " thing is probably fairly limited, and as to providing what the fans want, how will they ever know if we don't tell them and get them to listen?
As I said after the AGM, an army of fans may well still be something that is needed , but someone has to take the lead... I guess it may fall to the fans to make the offer as there has nothing tangible happened since the AGM....... |
Isn't that something the three full-time commercial bods should be thinking about, too?
100+ working hours per week between them is a very long time to be producing... ??
And if they're not adding value to the club, why are we paying them a wage?
[Post edited 14 Dec 2022 21:01]
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 21:20 - Dec 14 with 4269 views | foreverhopefulDale |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:51 - Dec 14 by 442Dale |
Under previous regimes, going back two decades, fans became so disillusioned by pointing out the bleeding obvious that apathy replaced any rage. The points you’ve raised could and would have been posted in here over the last 15 years, so again, what’s different? That’s what needs to be focused on.
That ‘volunteer army’, an excellent idea put forward at the AGM, what’s happened with creating a structure for it to exist effectively? |
Sorry marked down by mistake, meant to mark up, and agree with what you said | |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 11:07 - Dec 15 with 3754 views | Newbury_Dale |
Is the unimaginative output from social media down to Leighanns departure? |  | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 12:29 - Dec 15 with 3590 views | 49thseason |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 20:27 - Dec 14 by HullDale |
I was chatting to ATP earlier, & when you look at our media output in c.2 weeks since the Harrogate shocker its:
Frost Covers
Toy Appeal
Lotto
TVOS
Scoreboard Vacancy
Barrow Tickets
Postponement
Danny Lloyd
England v France
Sellebrity Match
Food Week
Food Week
Opening Hours
Lotto
Womens Networking
The latest video on our YouTube channel is still the Harrogate highlights.
No Xmas gift ideas, no Xmas ticket bundle, no video interview with the new guy, no engagement with managers or players. Under previous regimes we would've been raging about stuff like that &, although we should remain constructive, we shouldn't let these things slide. Players seemingly on holiday on social media just adds to the frustration.
Again, if rumours about cashflow are true, why is there no Xmas draw this year? A money spinner and a chance to engage with the wider town, and advertise something more relevant on our own hoardings than season tickets which went off sale ages ago.
There is a fanbase that feels closer to the club than ever before after the last 18 months - although we are years away from facilities like Accy, we need to be working harder than ever and sweating the assets we do have to survive. [Post edited 14 Dec 2022 20:29]
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The real problem is that none of this "output" is doing anything to attract a single new person onto the ground. Everything is aimed at those of us who are already supporters, season ticket holders and even share holders. We know most of what is going on already, its Joe and Jean Public with a son or daughter who wants to go to a game that we need to be talking to via our media platforms, but the question is, how do you reach them? Coming to the COA may not be the obvious choice, so they may not even bother google us and if they did what will they find? It needs a different approach.... leaflet drops, schools involvement, cubs , brownies, churches, advertising on buses, posters in shops etc. etc, ( Accy give away 1200 kids shirts every year). How many shirts and tickets could we give away by reducing 3 staff to 2?
Its the lack of a plan, and the oversight to make it work that is the problem, its OK letting people do the job they are qualified to do but without a plan to work to how do we know if its working? Who has the difficult conversations with them? Do they have targets to meet? Who sets the targets?
I think we all know that the club has been drifting for years, actually, probably forever, but unfortunately in tough times, the tough have to get going, not sit back and admire their new video and wonder why there are so few new customers.
As for the club shop, it probably needs to go totally online and be outsourced to a packing and distribution company. There must be days on end when no one goes into it.
What has the club done to extract any money from any of us this month? Extra club shop discount? Raffle? Christmas cards? Calendars? Christmas party offers? Have they been in touch with the new Bacon company yet? Have they done anything to attract new fans from Bury or anywhere else fo that matter??
The whole place lacks energy and can-do attitude. | | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 12:55 - Dec 15 with 3529 views | HullDale |
I'd disagree slightly on the shop - there is IMO still a clear place for bricks & mortar retail... BUT does it need to be at the back of the stadium? Or should it be near reception or even in the town centre? There are plenty of vacant units - if the calendar shop can afford one for 8 weeks a year, I'm certain Dale could negotiate a price for 12 months. Regardless of location, the inventory and online experience need to be miles better.
We're at home to Hartlepool on Boxing Day, & the weather suggests it should be on. We should be advertising £5 tickets all over the borough as a 'stocking filler' and dropping off free tickets in schools for kids under 12... god knows how much revenue we lost from Stockport being postponed, lets try and recoup some in 2 weeks' time.
Have the players been visiting schools over December? From a club perspective that would do more good than giving them their second mini break in a month.
I've seen ticket sales are still available for the Xmas party night on Saturday, but I only saw that through a tiny article on the official site (which, by the way, still has Kelly as a director).
The more I think about the lost opportunities and lack of innovation, the more frustrated I get. Chaff's article has turned me into Scrooge! [Post edited 15 Dec 2022 13:01]
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 13:23 - Dec 15 with 3462 views | James1980 |
I recall in the past cheap ticket offers have been met with a less than favourable response by some (no I don't remember who exactly) But there were season ticket holders disgruntled with the concept of a pay on the day ticket being cheaper than their pro rata ticket cost. | |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 14:30 - Dec 15 with 3349 views | HullDale |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 13:23 - Dec 15 by James1980 |
I recall in the past cheap ticket offers have been met with a less than favourable response by some (no I don't remember who exactly) But there were season ticket holders disgruntled with the concept of a pay on the day ticket being cheaper than their pro rata ticket cost. |
I'd hope that, amidst the economic climate and after the last 18 months, season ticket holders would be willing to accept it for one or two games to see how it goes.
If anyone is disgruntled, knock a quid off a pie, pint or programme for ST holders who choose to redeem it. The additional attendance and associated spend, as well as maybe additional ST holder spend on discounted items, should easily result in a net positive. | | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 19:53 - Dec 15 with 2939 views | James1980 |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 14:30 - Dec 15 by HullDale |
I'd hope that, amidst the economic climate and after the last 18 months, season ticket holders would be willing to accept it for one or two games to see how it goes.
If anyone is disgruntled, knock a quid off a pie, pint or programme for ST holders who choose to redeem it. The additional attendance and associated spend, as well as maybe additional ST holder spend on discounted items, should easily result in a net positive. |
Perhaps bring a friend for a fiver or ten pound pay on the day for certain matches. | |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 21:13 - Dec 15 with 2852 views | fourfourtwo |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 19:53 - Dec 15 by James1980 |
Perhaps bring a friend for a fiver or ten pound pay on the day for certain matches. |
Never makes a jot of difference.
Just usually means fans that pay on the day, borrow a ticket off their season ticket holder mate and get in cheaper than usual. | | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 21:54 - Dec 15 with 2783 views | 49thseason |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 21:13 - Dec 15 by fourfourtwo |
Never makes a jot of difference.
Just usually means fans that pay on the day, borrow a ticket off their season ticket holder mate and get in cheaper than usual. |
I don't think that's a problem as the seat has already been paid for .. Its like finding out someone cant go to the theatre and giving their ticket to someone else. and in any case the ticket recipient may be more inclined to buy their own ticket once they have been.
As I have often said , we have 5-6000 empty seats and spaces, filling them at almost any price is better than leaving them empty. We should plan to give away 500 parent and child tickets every game. with the ticket to be used again to buy more tickets at a big discount for more games or as a big discount voucher in the shop.. There is no point in being half hearted, go big or go home. With 10,000 free tickets just about every 7-11 year old in Rochdale could go with an adult.
The trick would be to make sure every child gets a goody bag that includes stuff about the players, how to buy more tickets, a colouring competition, a chance to get a player to coach at their school, some "Dale" sweets, a signed photo of Desmond and so on.
Its all about creating the habit of going to games | | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 11:02 - Dec 17 with 2168 views | 442Dale |
There’s been a lot of constructive criticism and positive suggestions on this thread over the last week. That in itself has to be seen as useful feedback by those at the club, who will of course read this forum and be open to utilising the views of fans to move forwards. | |
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| Staring Down The Barrel on 12:15 - Dec 17 with 2057 views | HullDale |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 11:02 - Dec 17 by 442Dale |
There’s been a lot of constructive criticism and positive suggestions on this thread over the last week. That in itself has to be seen as useful feedback by those at the club, who will of course read this forum and be open to utilising the views of fans to move forwards. |
I think the club are either reading the thread or made aware of it - the director list was updated on Friday. | | | |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 11:55 - Dec 18 with 1629 views | James1980 |
| Staring Down The Barrel on 12:15 - Dec 17 by HullDale |
I think the club are either reading the thread or made aware of it - the director list was updated on Friday. |
Lots of good idea for the club to look into.I suppose the issue is cost and potential return, but as the phrase goes 'you have to speculate to accumulate.'
Perhaps there could be a give away to encourage I follow viewing. Each game there is the opportunity to win one of say one of 5 pairs tickets to see a game within a calendar year, I follow viewers get entered into a hat.
Maybe a 3rd prize for the match day draw could be some tickets, voucher for coach travel etc. | |
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