| Black Lives Matter 19:25 - May 31 with 17618 views | Thacks_Rabbits |
The most obvious of statements to anyone with quarter of a brain, and yet what a paradox when we have thousands of morons ignoring social distancing, to protest about something, when it’s medically thought that black people are more susceptible. (Yes I know it was not all black people bit majority was).
It appears that the ex police officer and the deceased had personal issues between themselves and as such it’s likely to have nothing to do with race, but that does not stop some protesting in the USA by getting themselves a new tv and burning down a shop.
In no way did he deserve to die, I am sure we all agree, he was a violent criminal but seemed to have turned his life around, but as the tail wags the dog in the USA, fleas start jumping around in the uk.
The police do nothing, had it been the EDL lot then they would have, but they are toothless and only good for telling pensioners off for not understanding the rules.
We have had Cummings hammered, deservedly all week (won’t watch the last leg any more as it’s so left wing it’s sick), but when the second spike hits, it will be down to Boris, not these dickheads ignoring all advice.
To summarise, of course all lives matter, but if you don’t know that already, you won’t ever learn it! |  |
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| Black Lives Matter on 15:30 - Jun 2 with 2936 views | DaleiLama |
| Black Lives Matter on 12:24 - Jun 2 by joecooke |
Some positivity needed. Police officer in Louisiana |
I have also read about lots of kindness and acts of solidarity. Your point is not lost on me. But watch these and then come back to me and tell me you are still positive. I am sickened to the stomach that anyone can treat another human being like this, but when that person is employed to "protect and serve" it is truly beyond belief. If you can still be positive after this you have a better constitution than me! (PS I am about 36 hours behind on my twitter feed so sure there are many more just on my feed let alone the world wide web)
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| Black Lives Matter on 15:39 - Jun 2 with 2905 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Black Lives Matter on 15:25 - Jun 2 by isitme |
When that article was written he had been out of the league for years. He would have been signed as a back up and was not viewed as still being a good player (compare David Perkins in his first and second spells at Rochdale for a sort of example). His girlfriend cost him a contract, so it is disingenuous to say he did not have opportunities. Bad mouthing a potential employer is never a good approach.
I agree that anyone has the right to conduct a peaceful process for whatever issue they percieve as being important to them. I can also understand that some owners my find it a distraction as many bosses may not like employees protesting whilst they are at work. Outside of working time bosses cannot dictate what employees do unless it is illegal or a breach of contract.
What you may percieve as being peripheral others may class as widening the perspective as most political issues are rarely simple with simple solutions.
Specifically onto the Floyd killing and my opinion. What happened to him was wrong and people have the right to protest about this. Police brutality is an issue that should be addressed. Are all police brutal? No. Are all police racists? No. Do some of the police fall into these categories? Yes and they should be routed out.
Looter and rioters undermine peaceful protests. They help to reinforce negative stereotypes that unfortunately some people may have and are a barrier to change. I would say that a number of these looters and rioters are opportunist looking to exploit protests for their own means. Often these are anarchists with no interest in the causes they are sabotaging and are just out to cause trouble.
Affordable housing is a vital issue as these are often black people's houses, their neighbourhoods. In my earlier post on this topic I also cited an owner of a sports bar which was destroyted and looted, who put a sign up saying that it was a black owned business. He had put his life savings into that business venture. The looters even came back to try and steal his safe. In another area a housing block was set on fire and rioters were trying to prevent the fire brigade from tackling it. A small black child was one of the residents that they were trying to evacuate. So I would ask you how does looting and rioting further a cause?
What happened to him was unacceptable and yes police need to stop killing all innocent people, but the police stop killing black people will not address the many issues if black lives truly matter. Education, gang violence, drugs, racism etc are all what you would refer to as 'peripheral issues' which are important to improve the lives of black people.
I would also like people not to break into the home of a pregnant woman (black or white other) and point a gun at her stomatch demanding either drugs or money.
I have a very simple (and probably too simple) outlook in that I do not care what race, gender, sexual orientation, religion etc people are. They are either nice people or not nice people. I take people as I find them and everything else is peripheral. I think Martin Luther King summed it up very well.
If you would like to know anything else then please ask. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 15:36]
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I don’t think anybody would disagree that the issues go beyond being, disproportionately, the victims of police violence. However, stopping that would be a bloody good starting point wouldn’t you agree? I keep on hearing the bad apple defence - four officers stood by and watched him murder Floyd.
I certainly do not condone rioting and looting but shifting too much attention on to that and we lose sight of the real issue. Condoning rioting and looting does not, for one minute, change the fact that black people are disproportionately the victims of police violence. And that needs to end, looting or no looting.
The vast vast majority of black people are not in gangs or on drugs. That mindset needs to change. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 16:02]
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| Black Lives Matter on 16:03 - Jun 2 with 2851 views | isitme |
| Black Lives Matter on 15:39 - Jun 2 by BigDaveMyCock |
I don’t think anybody would disagree that the issues go beyond being, disproportionately, the victims of police violence. However, stopping that would be a bloody good starting point wouldn’t you agree? I keep on hearing the bad apple defence - four officers stood by and watched him murder Floyd.
I certainly do not condone rioting and looting but shifting too much attention on to that and we lose sight of the real issue. Condoning rioting and looting does not, for one minute, change the fact that black people are disproportionately the victims of police violence. And that needs to end, looting or no looting.
The vast vast majority of black people are not in gangs or on drugs. That mindset needs to change. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 16:02]
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Stopping that would be great but on its own it makes very little difference to the lives of black people as the vast majority of black people do not have much if any contact with the police.
Floyd was a bad apple, some have classed him as a violent career criminal, although that is not an excuse for the behaviour of those involved in his murder.
You have hit the nail on the head. The rioting and looting causes people to lose sight of the wider issues and as I mentioned previous reinforces negative stereotype in those who already hold these views.
Again I agree the vast majority of black people are not in gangs or on drugs. By the same token black people are over represented in terms of violent crimes, gang membership and drug dealing. All things that disproportionately affect predominantly black communities.
These are also issues that need to addressed if black lives matter. |  | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 16:05 - Jun 2 with 2849 views | joecooke |
| Black Lives Matter on 15:30 - Jun 2 by DaleiLama |
I have also read about lots of kindness and acts of solidarity. Your point is not lost on me. But watch these and then come back to me and tell me you are still positive. I am sickened to the stomach that anyone can treat another human being like this, but when that person is employed to "protect and serve" it is truly beyond belief. If you can still be positive after this you have a better constitution than me! (PS I am about 36 hours behind on my twitter feed so sure there are many more just on my feed let alone the world wide web)
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I have seen most of those clips and horrified was an understatement.
My reason for posting was to highlight that not all the police involved are as barbaric and cruel as the images that been highlighted, and as much as i felt repulsed by watching them ,i felt some gladness in seeing some restoration of faith in human nature in the ones i posted.
Suppose its the old hippy in me . |  |
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| Black Lives Matter on 16:23 - Jun 2 with 2797 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Black Lives Matter on 16:03 - Jun 2 by isitme |
Stopping that would be great but on its own it makes very little difference to the lives of black people as the vast majority of black people do not have much if any contact with the police.
Floyd was a bad apple, some have classed him as a violent career criminal, although that is not an excuse for the behaviour of those involved in his murder.
You have hit the nail on the head. The rioting and looting causes people to lose sight of the wider issues and as I mentioned previous reinforces negative stereotype in those who already hold these views.
Again I agree the vast majority of black people are not in gangs or on drugs. By the same token black people are over represented in terms of violent crimes, gang membership and drug dealing. All things that disproportionately affect predominantly black communities.
These are also issues that need to addressed if black lives matter. |
I was referring to the policeman who killed Floyd as being referred to as a bad apple. Floyd was only suspected of using a fake $20. Whatever he was in the past was not an issue at the time he was murdered. If you agree that the focus on rioting distracts people from the real issue then why, prior to being prompted by me, has that been your main focus and not the real issue?
At present, the slogan ‘black lives matter’ is being used in respect of police violence. I completely understand that you want it to mean more than that but accepting it’s current meaning (in respect of police brutality) do you agree with it?
I cannot confirm your over representation point.
If you don’t mind me saying your approach seems to be I will not argue for A because B,C and D won’t happen, despite A being very much in the best interests of black people. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 16:28]
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| Black Lives Matter on 16:49 - Jun 2 with 2651 views | isitme |
| Black Lives Matter on 16:23 - Jun 2 by BigDaveMyCock |
I was referring to the policeman who killed Floyd as being referred to as a bad apple. Floyd was only suspected of using a fake $20. Whatever he was in the past was not an issue at the time he was murdered. If you agree that the focus on rioting distracts people from the real issue then why, prior to being prompted by me, has that been your main focus and not the real issue?
At present, the slogan ‘black lives matter’ is being used in respect of police violence. I completely understand that you want it to mean more than that but accepting it’s current meaning (in respect of police brutality) do you agree with it?
I cannot confirm your over representation point.
If you don’t mind me saying your approach seems to be I will not argue for A because B,C and D won’t happen, despite A being very much in the best interests of black people. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 16:28]
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Because in my opinion addressing B,C,D etc would improve the lives of black people more than just focusing on police brutality. So I would prefer to focus on those issues. The vast majority of black people do not suffer from police brutality but are affected by other issues on a greater scale. Hence why, in my opinion other issues are more important. Although police brutality is an issue that does need to be addressed. Obviously other people may place greater weighting on other issues, which is their prerogative. You obviously view A as being more important than B,C etc.
Until you prompted me I had only briefly commented really early on the thread about looting and rioting and then lurked. Regarding Kaepernick I was trying to add some context as not many people would be aware of his back story otherwise I would have continued to lurk. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 16:55]
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| Black Lives Matter on 17:08 - Jun 2 with 2604 views | JumeirahDale |
| Black Lives Matter on 16:49 - Jun 2 by isitme |
Because in my opinion addressing B,C,D etc would improve the lives of black people more than just focusing on police brutality. So I would prefer to focus on those issues. The vast majority of black people do not suffer from police brutality but are affected by other issues on a greater scale. Hence why, in my opinion other issues are more important. Although police brutality is an issue that does need to be addressed. Obviously other people may place greater weighting on other issues, which is their prerogative. You obviously view A as being more important than B,C etc.
Until you prompted me I had only briefly commented really early on the thread about looting and rioting and then lurked. Regarding Kaepernick I was trying to add some context as not many people would be aware of his back story otherwise I would have continued to lurk. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 16:55]
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Regarding Kaepernick, there have been starters in the NFL since that have had inferior stats to even his final season, some playing due to injuries but others signed as FAs on the open market, and some veterans that received monster contracts even after playing worse than Kaepernick (look up Joe Flacco's stats from 2017, or Eli Manning's, or Andy Dalton's, and compare them with Kaepernick's 2016 stats). That said, I can acknowledge that we don't know what his demands to teams were, and this would also have played a part in why he doesn't have a contract. Until the NFL is successfully held to a subpoena, we won't know whether he was actively blackballed or not. Seeing some of the rhetoric of the owners though, I'm sure there are e-mails that many don't want to ever see the light of day, and there were plenty of comments at the time on his peaceful protest.
Like you, I couldn't bring myself to steal private property to make a point. But I also have zero experience of life as an African American. And I can't agree that the rioting is a barrier to change. History is littered with examples of real changes made following civil unrest like this:
- The unrest the country itself was founded upon - the Stamp Tax riots, the Boston Tea Party
- The unrest that pushed for state suffrage (removal of property ownership requirements to vote) - the Dorr rebellion in Rhode Island for example
- The unrest that led to police reform of sorts - the LA Riots at least drew global attention and started a conversation, but the Detroit riots in 1967 are equally if not more important (the 2017 film was excellent btw)
- The unrest that shone a light on LGBTQ conversations after the Stonewall riots and became the birthplace of the Pride Marches that drew 150,000 in New York alone last time I saw.
- The unrest at Kent State in 1970 had a disgusting outcome, but were hard for the nation to ignore the deaths of 4 unarmed student protestors and the shooting of 9 more, followed by shootings at other campuses. I'm sure Nixon's decision to withdraw from Cambodia had plenty of factors, but 100,000 people marching on Washington five days after Kent State had to have played a part.
Not all these changes were permanent, but they made a difference. And with an administration doing its level best to make voting more difficult (ref. recent actions in N. Dakota, Georgia, Alabama, Florida) or more intimidating (the Republican Party wants to recruit 50,000 volunteer "poll-watchers" for November, and how many of them will be showing up with their camo gear and AR-15s?), how do these voices make themselves heard? |  | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 17:28 - Jun 2 with 2560 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Black Lives Matter on 16:49 - Jun 2 by isitme |
Because in my opinion addressing B,C,D etc would improve the lives of black people more than just focusing on police brutality. So I would prefer to focus on those issues. The vast majority of black people do not suffer from police brutality but are affected by other issues on a greater scale. Hence why, in my opinion other issues are more important. Although police brutality is an issue that does need to be addressed. Obviously other people may place greater weighting on other issues, which is their prerogative. You obviously view A as being more important than B,C etc.
Until you prompted me I had only briefly commented really early on the thread about looting and rioting and then lurked. Regarding Kaepernick I was trying to add some context as not many people would be aware of his back story otherwise I would have continued to lurk. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 16:55]
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I believe A (stopping police brutality) is vital, I don’t necessarily believe it is more or less important than education etc.
I find your logic really odd. You can’t give any emphasis to A because you think B,C and D are more important? Surely they are just as important as each other and inextricably linked? What’s the point in economic and educational equality if you’re still getting the shit beaten out of you by a copper because of your colour? [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 21:59]
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| Black Lives Matter on 17:40 - Jun 2 with 2530 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Black Lives Matter on 17:08 - Jun 2 by JumeirahDale |
Regarding Kaepernick, there have been starters in the NFL since that have had inferior stats to even his final season, some playing due to injuries but others signed as FAs on the open market, and some veterans that received monster contracts even after playing worse than Kaepernick (look up Joe Flacco's stats from 2017, or Eli Manning's, or Andy Dalton's, and compare them with Kaepernick's 2016 stats). That said, I can acknowledge that we don't know what his demands to teams were, and this would also have played a part in why he doesn't have a contract. Until the NFL is successfully held to a subpoena, we won't know whether he was actively blackballed or not. Seeing some of the rhetoric of the owners though, I'm sure there are e-mails that many don't want to ever see the light of day, and there were plenty of comments at the time on his peaceful protest.
Like you, I couldn't bring myself to steal private property to make a point. But I also have zero experience of life as an African American. And I can't agree that the rioting is a barrier to change. History is littered with examples of real changes made following civil unrest like this:
- The unrest the country itself was founded upon - the Stamp Tax riots, the Boston Tea Party
- The unrest that pushed for state suffrage (removal of property ownership requirements to vote) - the Dorr rebellion in Rhode Island for example
- The unrest that led to police reform of sorts - the LA Riots at least drew global attention and started a conversation, but the Detroit riots in 1967 are equally if not more important (the 2017 film was excellent btw)
- The unrest that shone a light on LGBTQ conversations after the Stonewall riots and became the birthplace of the Pride Marches that drew 150,000 in New York alone last time I saw.
- The unrest at Kent State in 1970 had a disgusting outcome, but were hard for the nation to ignore the deaths of 4 unarmed student protestors and the shooting of 9 more, followed by shootings at other campuses. I'm sure Nixon's decision to withdraw from Cambodia had plenty of factors, but 100,000 people marching on Washington five days after Kent State had to have played a part.
Not all these changes were permanent, but they made a difference. And with an administration doing its level best to make voting more difficult (ref. recent actions in N. Dakota, Georgia, Alabama, Florida) or more intimidating (the Republican Party wants to recruit 50,000 volunteer "poll-watchers" for November, and how many of them will be showing up with their camo gear and AR-15s?), how do these voices make themselves heard? |
Surely if they get harassed by these poll-watchers then they can call the police...ah. | |
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| Black Lives Matter on 19:52 - Jun 2 with 2311 views | pioneer |
| Black Lives Matter on 15:25 - Jun 2 by isitme |
When that article was written he had been out of the league for years. He would have been signed as a back up and was not viewed as still being a good player (compare David Perkins in his first and second spells at Rochdale for a sort of example). His girlfriend cost him a contract, so it is disingenuous to say he did not have opportunities. Bad mouthing a potential employer is never a good approach.
I agree that anyone has the right to conduct a peaceful process for whatever issue they percieve as being important to them. I can also understand that some owners my find it a distraction as many bosses may not like employees protesting whilst they are at work. Outside of working time bosses cannot dictate what employees do unless it is illegal or a breach of contract.
What you may percieve as being peripheral others may class as widening the perspective as most political issues are rarely simple with simple solutions.
Specifically onto the Floyd killing and my opinion. What happened to him was wrong and people have the right to protest about this. Police brutality is an issue that should be addressed. Are all police brutal? No. Are all police racists? No. Do some of the police fall into these categories? Yes and they should be routed out.
Looter and rioters undermine peaceful protests. They help to reinforce negative stereotypes that unfortunately some people may have and are a barrier to change. I would say that a number of these looters and rioters are opportunist looking to exploit protests for their own means. Often these are anarchists with no interest in the causes they are sabotaging and are just out to cause trouble.
Affordable housing is a vital issue as these are often black people's houses, their neighbourhoods. In my earlier post on this topic I also cited an owner of a sports bar which was destroyted and looted, who put a sign up saying that it was a black owned business. He had put his life savings into that business venture. The looters even came back to try and steal his safe. In another area a housing block was set on fire and rioters were trying to prevent the fire brigade from tackling it. A small black child was one of the residents that they were trying to evacuate. So I would ask you how does looting and rioting further a cause?
What happened to him was unacceptable and yes police need to stop killing all innocent people, but the police stop killing black people will not address the many issues if black lives truly matter. Education, gang violence, drugs, racism etc are all what you would refer to as 'peripheral issues' which are important to improve the lives of black people.
I would also like people not to break into the home of a pregnant woman (black or white other) and point a gun at her stomatch demanding either drugs or money.
I have a very simple (and probably too simple) outlook in that I do not care what race, gender, sexual orientation, religion etc people are. They are either nice people or not nice people. I take people as I find them and everything else is peripheral. I think Martin Luther King summed it up very well.
If you would like to know anything else then please ask. [Post edited 2 Jun 2020 15:36]
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Seems to me like some US police seem to want to
use their own criteria on who is nice and who is not nice,
use different criteria for ‘niceness’ according to race
apply their own punishment for not being nice
use different levels of punishment according to race
Incidentally being ‘not nice’ is not a crime, even in the US.
Has any caucasian accused of using a counterfeit bill ever been murdered by the police?
African Americans have used peaceful protests for many years, with some losing their lives as a result, and yet they still face these problems....I cannot begin to imagine how this makes them feel, but I suppose the levels of injustice they still face on aregular and frequent basis despite playing by the rules may lead some of them to ‘lash out’. Yes, it makes no sense to those who have no experience of this injustice.
Kaepernick was hounded by the president of the country for God sake...so much for peaceful protest. He chose to base his protest on taking a knee during the playing of the national anthem, a song that was written by a wealthy slave owner which itself glorifies slavery (if you bother to go as far as the third verse), and is played in US schools every day. | | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 20:17 - Jun 2 with 2246 views | jonahwhereru |
Don’t want to reiterate the disgust that other on hear have voiced about the police actions, suffice to say I agree with them.
I do think that the commander in chief I.e. Trump simply does not have any of the skill set required to pour oil on the stormy water, and reach out to those who feel aggrieved. He is actually calling for a harder line to be taken with those aggrieved people. Regardless of if they are carrying a placard or a stolen television the are entitled to show their frustration with their lot in life. But of course Trump does not want to acknowledge those issues, especially in an election year. Given he has had had three years to change things and has only used his position to reinforce the confidence of the racists that are so prominent in the States.
If he does bring in to Army over the heads of the governors it will bring the country’s standing in the world to new depths.
I despair for the good people of America. | | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 20:44 - Jun 2 with 2190 views | SuddenLad |
| Black Lives Matter on 20:17 - Jun 2 by jonahwhereru |
Don’t want to reiterate the disgust that other on hear have voiced about the police actions, suffice to say I agree with them.
I do think that the commander in chief I.e. Trump simply does not have any of the skill set required to pour oil on the stormy water, and reach out to those who feel aggrieved. He is actually calling for a harder line to be taken with those aggrieved people. Regardless of if they are carrying a placard or a stolen television the are entitled to show their frustration with their lot in life. But of course Trump does not want to acknowledge those issues, especially in an election year. Given he has had had three years to change things and has only used his position to reinforce the confidence of the racists that are so prominent in the States.
If he does bring in to Army over the heads of the governors it will bring the country’s standing in the world to new depths.
I despair for the good people of America. |
Trump has no legal authority to overrule State Governors, by 'authorising' military intervention. If he attempts to do so, it will (a) inflame the situation beyond control and (b) end up with the Supreme Court ruling against him and nullifying the order.
That would be a humiliation too far for the buffoon in the White House. Whoever has advised him to threaten that is clueless.
Trump is currently writing his own suicide note. |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Black Lives Matter on 21:31 - Jun 2 with 2136 views | jonahwhereru |
| Black Lives Matter on 20:44 - Jun 2 by SuddenLad |
Trump has no legal authority to overrule State Governors, by 'authorising' military intervention. If he attempts to do so, it will (a) inflame the situation beyond control and (b) end up with the Supreme Court ruling against him and nullifying the order.
That would be a humiliation too far for the buffoon in the White House. Whoever has advised him to threaten that is clueless.
Trump is currently writing his own suicide note. |
The Insurrection Act, last used by old man Bush in 1992 (in a riot situation). Prior to that a few times in the 60’s.
I agree with your point a). It would cause damage on so many fronts. I wonder which countries / insituations would condone such an action and which would not? | | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 22:40 - Jun 2 with 2051 views | SuddenLad |
| Black Lives Matter on 21:31 - Jun 2 by jonahwhereru |
The Insurrection Act, last used by old man Bush in 1992 (in a riot situation). Prior to that a few times in the 60’s.
I agree with your point a). It would cause damage on so many fronts. I wonder which countries / insituations would condone such an action and which would not? |
But the Act does not permit the use of military personnel to quell domestic (civilian) violence, without the President first taking other actions in an attempt to stop the insurrection.
The use of the military for civilian law enforcement has been restrained as part of the Constitution’s protections for civil liberties and state sovereignty. Generally, speaking there are laws that forbid the use of the military as a domestic police force and in any event, it MUST be requested by the State Governor, not used as a tool to over-ride the authority of the State Governor. Tim Walz, the SG of Minnesota has already told Trump NOT to consider using the military. A clear refusal to allow them to enter the state at Trumps' behest.
Trump is in above his head. Way above. | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Black Lives Matter on 09:54 - Jun 3 with 1814 views | DaleDave |
There's a sign of endemic racism in the way that a lot of people comment on the murder of George Floyd and the ensuing unrest.
Just like earlier in this thread, a lot of people will say something like:
"Whilst it is sad someone died who was innocent until proven guilty. I agree, it does not give people the right to go on the rob, burn things & try to kill local Police.. I bet if it was their business / house being targeted they would ring 911."
But think about the order of that: 'whilst it is sad someone (yet another black person) was murdered by a cop, it's wrong to go rioting'.
Both of those statements can be right, but where are we putting the emphasis? Shouldn't we be saying 'Whist it's wrong to go rioting, someone (yet another black man) was murdered by a cop.' ?
I'm not suggesting anyone does this intentionally, but the fact that so many people structure their views by emphasising that the really wrong thing is damage to property and theft, instead of repeated murder and abuse of power from police forces targeted disproportionately against black people, should be an alarm bell that something is seriously wrong, and it goes deep in to the core of society. | | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 10:34 - Jun 3 with 1771 views | James1980 |
| Black Lives Matter on 09:54 - Jun 3 by DaleDave |
There's a sign of endemic racism in the way that a lot of people comment on the murder of George Floyd and the ensuing unrest.
Just like earlier in this thread, a lot of people will say something like:
"Whilst it is sad someone died who was innocent until proven guilty. I agree, it does not give people the right to go on the rob, burn things & try to kill local Police.. I bet if it was their business / house being targeted they would ring 911."
But think about the order of that: 'whilst it is sad someone (yet another black person) was murdered by a cop, it's wrong to go rioting'.
Both of those statements can be right, but where are we putting the emphasis? Shouldn't we be saying 'Whist it's wrong to go rioting, someone (yet another black man) was murdered by a cop.' ?
I'm not suggesting anyone does this intentionally, but the fact that so many people structure their views by emphasising that the really wrong thing is damage to property and theft, instead of repeated murder and abuse of power from police forces targeted disproportionately against black people, should be an alarm bell that something is seriously wrong, and it goes deep in to the core of society. |
Sorry was being nosy and ended up pressing down | |
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| Black Lives Matter on 12:05 - Jun 3 with 1686 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Black Lives Matter on 09:54 - Jun 3 by DaleDave |
There's a sign of endemic racism in the way that a lot of people comment on the murder of George Floyd and the ensuing unrest.
Just like earlier in this thread, a lot of people will say something like:
"Whilst it is sad someone died who was innocent until proven guilty. I agree, it does not give people the right to go on the rob, burn things & try to kill local Police.. I bet if it was their business / house being targeted they would ring 911."
But think about the order of that: 'whilst it is sad someone (yet another black person) was murdered by a cop, it's wrong to go rioting'.
Both of those statements can be right, but where are we putting the emphasis? Shouldn't we be saying 'Whist it's wrong to go rioting, someone (yet another black man) was murdered by a cop.' ?
I'm not suggesting anyone does this intentionally, but the fact that so many people structure their views by emphasising that the really wrong thing is damage to property and theft, instead of repeated murder and abuse of power from police forces targeted disproportionately against black people, should be an alarm bell that something is seriously wrong, and it goes deep in to the core of society. |
This is exactly it. It’s a clever and subtle way of shifting emphasis away from the ‘issue’. For example, the counter slogan of ‘all lives matter‘ (of course they do, but they clearly don’t for some in the police who think it’s permissible to use unnecessary force disproportionately against black people - and that’s the fooking issue at the moment). All of a sudden the important message of black lives mattering just as much as white lives is replaced, submersed and very subtly denied.The issue is replaced with another more ‘acceptable‘ issue of all lives mattering. It becomes no longer an issue of racism, when in reality it so fooking obviously is. White lives matter just as much black lives! There, the issue has gone away.
The argument that I do not wish to emphasise the issue because I think things such as education and economic equality is more important as an issue is also nonsense. It’s just longhand for I don’t want to engage with something I clearly can’t morally argue against, or don’t want to be seen to argue against, so I’ll shift the attention away by focusing on other issues with the hope of subtly discrediting the issue.
I hope the reason for it is that the issue is too unbearable for some to engage with. I don’t know though. [Post edited 3 Jun 2020 12:19]
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| Black Lives Matter on 12:52 - Jun 3 with 1631 views | Brierls |
SuddenLad's first post on the thread sums it up for me.
I know somebody listed things you shouldn't talk about on the messageboard, with religion being one of them, but I have been taken by surprise at the brainwashed religious posts on Twitter. Trump could beat their youngest to death with a bible and these idiots would thank him for it.
When this thread started, I was waiting for 'jonesy' to appear. One click on this username and viewing the posts told you all you need to know. That is past tense, as clicking the username says user no longer exists. Good riddance.
Thacks is coming across like one of the older generation. He doesn't think he's being racist, but some of the things he says can easily be interepted as racist, he just can't see it. Like I said, I don't think its his intention and Riddler lost the plot (again). |  | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 13:13 - Jun 3 with 1591 views | James1980 |
Of course racism should be dealt with nay eradicated. I don't think actions and phrases that the fascists can use as propaganda are the right way though. Obviously as a pasty lower middle class chap whose hasn't really experienced any real struggles I will never understand. Black people should not live in fear because of their skin colour. The authorities should not attack people exercising their democratic right to peaceful protest. | |
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| Black Lives Matter on 13:30 - Jun 3 with 1564 views | NorthernDale |
Black lives matter is an absurd slogan, in that all lives matter, no matter the skin colour and this slogan is too some extent divisive. It is approach that the left seem to adopt to exploit and benefit from in terms of votes and support. As stated every life matters, no what background or ethnic or colour of the skin they come from.
I feel the actions of the criminal element as damage the move towards equality, in that riots, violence and looting helps creates an image of the black community of being more of a criminal disposition, then the white community, which could not be further then the truth. The actions of a tiny minority will stereotype the image of the black community, especially when it as been reported that around 5 or 6 police officers have been shot by the protesters and this criminal and violent minority should be called out by the decent and good protesters, who want justice for Mr Floyd. | | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 13:36 - Jun 3 with 1522 views | James1980 |
| Black Lives Matter on 13:30 - Jun 3 by NorthernDale |
Black lives matter is an absurd slogan, in that all lives matter, no matter the skin colour and this slogan is too some extent divisive. It is approach that the left seem to adopt to exploit and benefit from in terms of votes and support. As stated every life matters, no what background or ethnic or colour of the skin they come from.
I feel the actions of the criminal element as damage the move towards equality, in that riots, violence and looting helps creates an image of the black community of being more of a criminal disposition, then the white community, which could not be further then the truth. The actions of a tiny minority will stereotype the image of the black community, especially when it as been reported that around 5 or 6 police officers have been shot by the protesters and this criminal and violent minority should be called out by the decent and good protesters, who want justice for Mr Floyd. |
The analogy, you have probably seen or heard it, is, you don't put out a house that isn't on fire. | |
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| Black Lives Matter on 14:23 - Jun 3 with 1469 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Black Lives Matter on 13:30 - Jun 3 by NorthernDale |
Black lives matter is an absurd slogan, in that all lives matter, no matter the skin colour and this slogan is too some extent divisive. It is approach that the left seem to adopt to exploit and benefit from in terms of votes and support. As stated every life matters, no what background or ethnic or colour of the skin they come from.
I feel the actions of the criminal element as damage the move towards equality, in that riots, violence and looting helps creates an image of the black community of being more of a criminal disposition, then the white community, which could not be further then the truth. The actions of a tiny minority will stereotype the image of the black community, especially when it as been reported that around 5 or 6 police officers have been shot by the protesters and this criminal and violent minority should be called out by the decent and good protesters, who want justice for Mr Floyd. |
Here we go again. Black lives matter - a slogan that black people use in response to a disproportionate loss of life in their community at the hands of the police you say is ‘absurd’. A slogan they use because their lives don’t seem to matter as much as whites when it comes to law enforcement. They shouldn’t use it because it doesn’t include us whites. It’s them that’s really being racist here isn’t it?
Let’s focus on the apparently omnipresent left, it’s their fault. The criminal element and the rioters as well. If it wasn’t for all of these the issue wouldn’t even be an issue.
The reason why black lives is a slogan is that the reality is all lives don’t matter. [Post edited 3 Jun 2020 14:28]
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| Black Lives Matter on 14:28 - Jun 3 with 1464 views | JumeirahDale |
| Black Lives Matter on 13:30 - Jun 3 by NorthernDale |
Black lives matter is an absurd slogan, in that all lives matter, no matter the skin colour and this slogan is too some extent divisive. It is approach that the left seem to adopt to exploit and benefit from in terms of votes and support. As stated every life matters, no what background or ethnic or colour of the skin they come from.
I feel the actions of the criminal element as damage the move towards equality, in that riots, violence and looting helps creates an image of the black community of being more of a criminal disposition, then the white community, which could not be further then the truth. The actions of a tiny minority will stereotype the image of the black community, especially when it as been reported that around 5 or 6 police officers have been shot by the protesters and this criminal and violent minority should be called out by the decent and good protesters, who want justice for Mr Floyd. |
"in that riots, violence and looting helps creates an image of the black community of being more of a criminal disposition which could not be further from the truth"
The fact that rioting by white people doesn't create the same image is part of the endemic racism being referred to. I've given a list further up of civil unrest events and riots, in which white people were active if not leading several. Nobody looks at those events and believes they characterise white people. Your argument is proving the exact point many are making.
Nobody is saying all lives don't matter. And flagging "the left" for exploiting divisive rhetoric is so tone deaf, I don't even know where to start. | | | |
| Black Lives Matter on 16:11 - Jun 3 with 1387 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Black Lives Matter on 14:28 - Jun 3 by JumeirahDale |
"in that riots, violence and looting helps creates an image of the black community of being more of a criminal disposition which could not be further from the truth"
The fact that rioting by white people doesn't create the same image is part of the endemic racism being referred to. I've given a list further up of civil unrest events and riots, in which white people were active if not leading several. Nobody looks at those events and believes they characterise white people. Your argument is proving the exact point many are making.
Nobody is saying all lives don't matter. And flagging "the left" for exploiting divisive rhetoric is so tone deaf, I don't even know where to start. |
Many pictures of white people involved in the disorder, as you say not reported widely |  |
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| Black Lives Matter on 16:22 - Jun 3 with 1366 views | James1980 |
| Black Lives Matter on 16:11 - Jun 3 by rochdaleriddler |
Many pictures of white people involved in the disorder, as you say not reported widely |
What are the chances they are right wing agent provacateurs? | |
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