FA Trophy semi on 20:56 - Apr 5 with 3662 views | 442Dale |
FA Trophy semi on 20:53 - Apr 5 by D_Alien | Thanks I wonder about his own personal resources Managers are (of course...) only human, but he's never struck me as someone who can easily shrug off adversity |
Possibly not, and that was a worry watching it. I totally understand the reasoning behind not wanting to listen to the often repetitive inability to address the concerns we all have, but would say to give this one a go. If only to gain an appreciation of the mood… though it’ll probably not help yours. |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 20:57 - Apr 5 with 3646 views | 442Dale |
FA Trophy semi on 20:53 - Apr 5 by Clivert | Point missed. |
Indeed. So we can leave it there. |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 20:59 - Apr 5 with 3624 views | nordenblue |
FA Trophy semi on 20:46 - Apr 5 by 442Dale | He seems completely down after the result.. At this stage, I really fear for our season. Even after a few more favourable results today. Sounds like the players too have taken a massive hit. Obviously all fans have too. I think today will go down as one of those awful days in the life of a Dale fan. Up there with Stockport and similar cup defeats. |
I think the part that hurts the most is after all the shite and worry for everyone connected to the club for years this was as big a chance as we will EVER get to reach a final and play at Wembley, something that might not happen again for years and years and we've passed it up without even a whimper, this loss is FAR far bigger than that to FC United or even any other game i can remember in decades. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 21:02 - Apr 5 with 3545 views | 442Dale |
FA Trophy semi on 20:59 - Apr 5 by nordenblue | I think the part that hurts the most is after all the shite and worry for everyone connected to the club for years this was as big a chance as we will EVER get to reach a final and play at Wembley, something that might not happen again for years and years and we've passed it up without even a whimper, this loss is FAR far bigger than that to FC United or even any other game i can remember in decades. |
On that, most would be agreeing. When that header crept in, it was like it wasn’t really happening. Awful feeling. |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 21:09 - Apr 5 with 3498 views | D_Alien |
FA Trophy semi on 20:56 - Apr 5 by 442Dale | Possibly not, and that was a worry watching it. I totally understand the reasoning behind not wanting to listen to the often repetitive inability to address the concerns we all have, but would say to give this one a go. If only to gain an appreciation of the mood… though it’ll probably not help yours. |
I left the ground more in a mood of "resignation" than feeling gutted or despondent The reason being, once their late equaliser went in, there was an air of inevitability about the penalties outcome and i'd already processed the initial disappointment (takes years of practice watching Dale to do that) Another reason being the sense throughout the game of us not giving it our best shot, as was massively hoped (and posted about) beforehand I won't watch the interview, but there's also a sense he could end up more than a bit broken by the time the ref blows full-time on this season |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 21:10 - Apr 5 with 3485 views | 49thseason | We should have been home and hosed by half time, Allarakhia could have been replaced and a debacle avoided, that we were not is down to Head Coach who once again overthought the problem he faced and instead of going toe to toe, decided to try and be clever and try to wear the part- timers down.. All the time we were passing across the back, they were jogging left and right across midfield. Once again there was no pace or width. Mr professional intellectual football manager got it wrong again and Spennymoor grew in confidence, their goalkeeper completely untroubled for the first 45 minutes. If they were playing for penalties JM was only too happy to help.... what was he thinking, ? Score and early goal and they were there for the taking but no, sideways, back, sideways, back again. Henderson was making run after run, no one cared enough to try to pass to him, Allarakhia was playing on one leg, JM seemed to think that was OK. Rodney decided this was a good day to forget how to trap a ball and Beckwith had possibly his worst half of the season....where was the management? Where was the attitude? This is our house our party! I think JM has done his best, but we need a Manager, a Leader, not a Head Coach and today was all the evidence needed. The fear was palpable, the cost of the defeat is incalculable. And it simply didnt have to be this way.... This is Professional Sport there are winners and the rest, I am sick of making up numbers....This team should have been comfortable Winners today, the buck stops with the Head Coach. His target outcome is now simple,....get promoted....... |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 21:15 - Apr 5 with 3401 views | Newbury_Dale |
FA Trophy semi on 21:10 - Apr 5 by 49thseason | We should have been home and hosed by half time, Allarakhia could have been replaced and a debacle avoided, that we were not is down to Head Coach who once again overthought the problem he faced and instead of going toe to toe, decided to try and be clever and try to wear the part- timers down.. All the time we were passing across the back, they were jogging left and right across midfield. Once again there was no pace or width. Mr professional intellectual football manager got it wrong again and Spennymoor grew in confidence, their goalkeeper completely untroubled for the first 45 minutes. If they were playing for penalties JM was only too happy to help.... what was he thinking, ? Score and early goal and they were there for the taking but no, sideways, back, sideways, back again. Henderson was making run after run, no one cared enough to try to pass to him, Allarakhia was playing on one leg, JM seemed to think that was OK. Rodney decided this was a good day to forget how to trap a ball and Beckwith had possibly his worst half of the season....where was the management? Where was the attitude? This is our house our party! I think JM has done his best, but we need a Manager, a Leader, not a Head Coach and today was all the evidence needed. The fear was palpable, the cost of the defeat is incalculable. And it simply didnt have to be this way.... This is Professional Sport there are winners and the rest, I am sick of making up numbers....This team should have been comfortable Winners today, the buck stops with the Head Coach. His target outcome is now simple,....get promoted....... |
Bang on. This is a good squad of players for the level, that isn't going to realise it's potential because of McNulty and his over coaching. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 21:44 - Apr 5 with 3197 views | James1980 |
FA Trophy semi on 21:15 - Apr 5 by Newbury_Dale | Bang on. This is a good squad of players for the level, that isn't going to realise it's potential because of McNulty and his over coaching. |
How did this 'good squad' manage to get to a cup semi final and be in a playoff position with seven games to go with Moby Dick in charge? |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 21:53 - Apr 5 with 3127 views | pnc4eva1 | Today was one of the days. I'm not defending anyone but it was the essence of football. Yes we should have won Yes we were poor in the first half. Yes we should have been out of sight. Yes we should have cleared the ball. Yes he should have scored the 5th penalty. But we didn't. After decades of watching Dale I'm used to missing opportunities. I'm also used to us doing better than we should. Today we didn't make it but I'll come back again for more. I drive miles to come up to see the Dale as an exile. I have for the last decade. I'll keep coming back for more punishment. We regroup and we keep going. We keep believing |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 22:08 - Apr 5 with 3027 views | dingdangblue |
FA Trophy semi on 21:44 - Apr 5 by James1980 | How did this 'good squad' manage to get to a cup semi final and be in a playoff position with seven games to go with Moby Dick in charge? |
In truth James we were so so lucky to get past Stockton. They had 2 penalties to win it and fluffed them both - we should have been well out of this competition a while ago. |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 22:11 - Apr 5 with 3009 views | Sandyman | We were asked to turn up in colours. Many did. We were asked to get the stadium rocking. We did. After twenty minutes, the stadium was silent. The regulars were shaking their heads. The big new crowd were bored to tears. Jim ball, again. It was awful, boring, turgid, innefectual rubbish in the first half. If any of the newbies went home after that, you could not blame them. Second half, we had a go, as we can, and it worked. Poor goals to concede but many chances we coud've converted to make it 3-1 or 3-2 and a visit to Wembley. Nah. The Spennymoor lads who went to work this week beat the sauna boys. Good luck to them. Jim can whine as much as he likes post-match but that first half let us down massively. We've seen that type of rank performance so many times, and yet, it is repeated again and again. Today, in front of a big crowd that could have helped to sell "Project 5000" so much. His tactics failed this club today. Again. He has the chance to rescue the season in the play offs but that is his last chance. So many regulars are sick to death of this unwatchable tippy tappy tripe when we are so much better attacking. Many are reconsidering their faith in this manager and also season card purchases for the 2025/6 campaign. Understandable. He can change by results or he has to be changed. [Post edited 6 Apr 6:44]
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FA Trophy semi on 22:12 - Apr 5 with 2999 views | James1980 |
FA Trophy semi on 22:08 - Apr 5 by dingdangblue | In truth James we were so so lucky to get past Stockton. They had 2 penalties to win it and fluffed them both - we should have been well out of this competition a while ago. |
Something about aunties and gonads I believe is the standard rebuttal for a what might have been. |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 22:44 - Apr 5 with 2864 views | dingdangblue | No wonder Jim looks 'numb' in that interview. He'll have to live with that for the rest of his life. The manager of Rochdale who had the chance to take the town to Wembley for a cup final - a home game against 'no disrespect' part time Spennymoor from the league below and he's failed miserably. |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 22:51 - Apr 5 with 2831 views | nordenblue |
FA Trophy semi on 21:44 - Apr 5 by James1980 | How did this 'good squad' manage to get to a cup semi final and be in a playoff position with seven games to go with Moby Dick in charge? |
This current crop of players have got to this position in the league despite of Jim not as a result of his wonderful ideas, let's make something pretty clear this league is absolutely terrible with the exception of a couple of sides, look how crap Oldham are too and how high up in the league they are. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 23:01 - Apr 5 with 2763 views | James1980 |
FA Trophy semi on 22:51 - Apr 5 by nordenblue | This current crop of players have got to this position in the league despite of Jim not as a result of his wonderful ideas, let's make something pretty clear this league is absolutely terrible with the exception of a couple of sides, look how crap Oldham are too and how high up in the league they are. |
Right so a win or a good draw = players chose the tactics Loss or clutching a draw from jaws of victory = the white whale, who must be hunted down, chose them. Got it |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 23:23 - Apr 5 with 2652 views | Sandyman |
FA Trophy semi on 23:01 - Apr 5 by James1980 | Right so a win or a good draw = players chose the tactics Loss or clutching a draw from jaws of victory = the white whale, who must be hunted down, chose them. Got it |
Nonsense, James. We've seen great attacking performances and credited the manager and his players accordingly. We've seen abysmal performances and credited the manager and his players accordingly. A one-eyed Jim Love In is not required right now. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 00:13 - Apr 6 with 2510 views | dawlishdale | Crumbs. That was awful for the people who turned up and gave us yet another chance. They've probably given us several chances down the years but the opportunity to roar us on to Wembley against lower league opponents lured them back. Let me say one thing. We will never ever progress with Jim in charge. He is far too cautious, careful or negative. Choose what you want. I'm sick and tired of us not attacking when we should be trying to kill off games be it home or away. I'm sick and tired of the feeble excuses the Jim trots out and his almost complete disregard for entertaining the crowd...whether it's 2000 or 6000. There can be no excuses for our boring boring football when the board is trying to increase attendances. Thanks Jim. But no thanks. I for one hate your insipid negative brand of football...made much worse given the awful standard of this league and the relative strength of the squad. Good luck Spennymore. You had more guts on the day than we were allowed. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 01:42 - Apr 6 with 2399 views | borodale | Knew Spennymoor would equalize when the assistant (Gibbins) was telling the players to slow it down and defend. Handed the initiative to Spennymoor who had been threatening when they got forward all game. Why Alarakia was left on whilst clearly injured was staggering. We really are weak. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 09:08 - Apr 6 with 1916 views | fitzochris | I had hoped that a night’s sleep would help me see things differently, but alas, I’m feeling just as hollow as I did at the final whistle yesterday. We had the most favourable draw of the semi-finals and, whatever way you look at it, we blew it. A huge opportunity for the club on numerous levels, gone in the blink of an eye thanks to a missed penalty. Of course, it’s not as simple as that. A lacklustre first half, despite a bright start, was followed by a dominant second half that lacked the requisite volume of goals to put the game to bed. This is a theme that’s been all too familiar this season, and unfortunately, the outcome has been terminal. Usually, it’s two points dropped, but in this case, the weight of it feels much heavier to bear. I was punching with positivity on two fronts, and now one of those has gone in ignominious fashion. If us fans feel this dejected, I can only imagine how the players will feel. It’s McNulty’s job to pick them up and see us over the finish line, so the second front of positivity is at least fulfilled. However, hearing his post-match interview was a concern, and I can only hope that a night’s sleep has done more for his outlook than it has for mine. We have a squad, still riddled with injuries and low morale after the semi-final, that somehow has to secure a top-seven spot. Ordinarily, with the games in hand, you'd be looking at at least a fifth-place finish. But with this squad now, who knows? The end of this season needs a serious sit-down with the Ogdens and the football operations side of the club. This three-year plan then needs to be laid out clearly to us supporters so that we aren’t labouring under any false comprehension of what McNulty’s objectives are, year on year. It’s no good the fans berating him for this and that if the Ogdens are telling him something different. A bit of transparency will at least let us know where we stand with our own expectations. Regardless of that, this summer has to be about a solid squad rebuild. A proper no.9, a no.10, central midfield, and crucially, a permanent keeper are all priorities. The current situation between the sticks isn’t sustainable, and we need a reliable long-term solution in goal. There also needs to be less reliance on loan players across the rest of the pitch and less project players. The players we bring in should be our own, there to bide their time on the sidelines for when they’re needed, not brought in as a panic measure when they’re suddenly required. That’s the best way to withstand the rigours of a campaign at this level. Finally, there simply has to be more urgency in that final third. I’m in the minority when it comes to the patient build-up, I know, but honestly, I don’t care as long as, when the ball gets into the final third – whether by air or along the ground – we terrify opposition defences. With the right personnel, that’s the way to ensure we don’t end up drawing games we should’ve won or losing games we should’ve drawn. Our comprehensive victories this season show we’re more than capable when that urgency is applied |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 09:28 - Apr 6 with 1807 views | EllDale | I haven’t been this despondent for a long time. That’s probably my best chance ever of seeing Dale play in a cup final at Wembley disappear. Every week I seem to come away thinking if only….and I was the same yesterday. If their keeper hadn’t produced a couple of decent saves to deny Barlow and Hendo. If only Gilmour’s shot had hit the inside of the post and gone in instead of bouncing back off the keeper. If only Taryn had buried that free header. The ironic thing is that, with three minutes of stoppage time gone, we had a chance to really bore Spennymoor to death by the corner flag. For once we drove forward and smashed over the cross….. Random thoughts strike as well. I think Tobi was definitely missed down the right. If he was suspended for accumulating yellow cards I hope that one of them wasn’t for running off the pitch at Leamington! We’re critical of their second goal but the first equaliser was just as daft with possession needlessly conceded. And this keeper may be decent with the ball at his feet but has anyone actually seen him save a shot yet? I agree 100% with Fitzochris that recruitment needs to include a permanent keeper as well as the other positions that he mentions. There were two factors yesterday as well. One was the strong wind which no one else seems to have mentioned. The other is that we were, yet again, slow to get to second balls all over the pitch. A problem that needs addressing. How BJ lifts this team for Tuesday I don’t know. A major challenge. And I’ll be in the Sandy as usual on Saturday but I don’t expect more than 2000 other souls to bother. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 09:29 - Apr 6 with 1798 views | RooleyMoorBlue |
FA Trophy semi on 09:08 - Apr 6 by fitzochris | I had hoped that a night’s sleep would help me see things differently, but alas, I’m feeling just as hollow as I did at the final whistle yesterday. We had the most favourable draw of the semi-finals and, whatever way you look at it, we blew it. A huge opportunity for the club on numerous levels, gone in the blink of an eye thanks to a missed penalty. Of course, it’s not as simple as that. A lacklustre first half, despite a bright start, was followed by a dominant second half that lacked the requisite volume of goals to put the game to bed. This is a theme that’s been all too familiar this season, and unfortunately, the outcome has been terminal. Usually, it’s two points dropped, but in this case, the weight of it feels much heavier to bear. I was punching with positivity on two fronts, and now one of those has gone in ignominious fashion. If us fans feel this dejected, I can only imagine how the players will feel. It’s McNulty’s job to pick them up and see us over the finish line, so the second front of positivity is at least fulfilled. However, hearing his post-match interview was a concern, and I can only hope that a night’s sleep has done more for his outlook than it has for mine. We have a squad, still riddled with injuries and low morale after the semi-final, that somehow has to secure a top-seven spot. Ordinarily, with the games in hand, you'd be looking at at least a fifth-place finish. But with this squad now, who knows? The end of this season needs a serious sit-down with the Ogdens and the football operations side of the club. This three-year plan then needs to be laid out clearly to us supporters so that we aren’t labouring under any false comprehension of what McNulty’s objectives are, year on year. It’s no good the fans berating him for this and that if the Ogdens are telling him something different. A bit of transparency will at least let us know where we stand with our own expectations. Regardless of that, this summer has to be about a solid squad rebuild. A proper no.9, a no.10, central midfield, and crucially, a permanent keeper are all priorities. The current situation between the sticks isn’t sustainable, and we need a reliable long-term solution in goal. There also needs to be less reliance on loan players across the rest of the pitch and less project players. The players we bring in should be our own, there to bide their time on the sidelines for when they’re needed, not brought in as a panic measure when they’re suddenly required. That’s the best way to withstand the rigours of a campaign at this level. Finally, there simply has to be more urgency in that final third. I’m in the minority when it comes to the patient build-up, I know, but honestly, I don’t care as long as, when the ball gets into the final third – whether by air or along the ground – we terrify opposition defences. With the right personnel, that’s the way to ensure we don’t end up drawing games we should’ve won or losing games we should’ve drawn. Our comprehensive victories this season show we’re more than capable when that urgency is applied |
I couldn't have put it better myself, brilliant post. I'd just like to add, a big thank you goes out to those hooligans who have tarnished our reputation as a family club and who caused the club car park to be sealed off for 30 minutes+ . We don't need your sort, so do us a favour and stay home next time there is a big game at the COA. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 09:58 - Apr 6 with 1631 views | Plattyswrinklynuts |
FA Trophy semi on 09:08 - Apr 6 by fitzochris | I had hoped that a night’s sleep would help me see things differently, but alas, I’m feeling just as hollow as I did at the final whistle yesterday. We had the most favourable draw of the semi-finals and, whatever way you look at it, we blew it. A huge opportunity for the club on numerous levels, gone in the blink of an eye thanks to a missed penalty. Of course, it’s not as simple as that. A lacklustre first half, despite a bright start, was followed by a dominant second half that lacked the requisite volume of goals to put the game to bed. This is a theme that’s been all too familiar this season, and unfortunately, the outcome has been terminal. Usually, it’s two points dropped, but in this case, the weight of it feels much heavier to bear. I was punching with positivity on two fronts, and now one of those has gone in ignominious fashion. If us fans feel this dejected, I can only imagine how the players will feel. It’s McNulty’s job to pick them up and see us over the finish line, so the second front of positivity is at least fulfilled. However, hearing his post-match interview was a concern, and I can only hope that a night’s sleep has done more for his outlook than it has for mine. We have a squad, still riddled with injuries and low morale after the semi-final, that somehow has to secure a top-seven spot. Ordinarily, with the games in hand, you'd be looking at at least a fifth-place finish. But with this squad now, who knows? The end of this season needs a serious sit-down with the Ogdens and the football operations side of the club. This three-year plan then needs to be laid out clearly to us supporters so that we aren’t labouring under any false comprehension of what McNulty’s objectives are, year on year. It’s no good the fans berating him for this and that if the Ogdens are telling him something different. A bit of transparency will at least let us know where we stand with our own expectations. Regardless of that, this summer has to be about a solid squad rebuild. A proper no.9, a no.10, central midfield, and crucially, a permanent keeper are all priorities. The current situation between the sticks isn’t sustainable, and we need a reliable long-term solution in goal. There also needs to be less reliance on loan players across the rest of the pitch and less project players. The players we bring in should be our own, there to bide their time on the sidelines for when they’re needed, not brought in as a panic measure when they’re suddenly required. That’s the best way to withstand the rigours of a campaign at this level. Finally, there simply has to be more urgency in that final third. I’m in the minority when it comes to the patient build-up, I know, but honestly, I don’t care as long as, when the ball gets into the final third – whether by air or along the ground – we terrify opposition defences. With the right personnel, that’s the way to ensure we don’t end up drawing games we should’ve won or losing games we should’ve drawn. Our comprehensive victories this season show we’re more than capable when that urgency is applied |
To say that the first half was lacklustre is a huge understatement. Yesterday was project 5000 in a nutshell, at HT I heard fans openly questioning why they had bothered to waste a sunny Sat afternoon watching that turgid garbage. Personally I don’t give a flying fook about 3/5/10 year plans, we must get out of this division asap before the club finds itself mired down there. I’ve mentioned a chief exec role before, someone who knows the game & isn’t afraid to make difficult decisions if necessary.. We contrived to lose so much goodwill both on & off the pitch yesterday, it’s going to take a huge effort to get it back. |  | |  |
FA Trophy semi on 10:32 - Apr 6 with 1505 views | mikehunt | A night's kip hasn't lessened the effect of the actual nightmare that unfolded yesterday. Unfortunately, you can write Dale scripts in big match scenarios - all with negative outcomes. All with opposition fans celebrating on our pitch instead of us. I am seriously p@ssed off with this capitulation: which is a culmination of all the other capitulations we have had to witness this season - which seemto have occurred far more frequently this season. The only way I can forgive this particular debacle is to win the play-offs. We are owed this big-style. If we wimp out of the play-offs too, then I don't know if I can take any more false-dawns and disappointments. I've waited 60 years for some good times. Appart from the first promotion season, are those few years with Keef really going to be the pinnacle of my years of support? I'm getting weary and there are better things to do with the limited time I have left on this planet, than get worked up every bloody weekend. If we blow the play-offs, tell the Ogdens thank you very much, but lock the gates and throw away the keys. You are simply shoving shit uphill. [Post edited 6 Apr 10:35]
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| The worm of time turns not for the cuckoo of circumstance. |
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FA Trophy semi on 10:36 - Apr 6 with 1467 views | D_Alien |
FA Trophy semi on 09:28 - Apr 6 by EllDale | I haven’t been this despondent for a long time. That’s probably my best chance ever of seeing Dale play in a cup final at Wembley disappear. Every week I seem to come away thinking if only….and I was the same yesterday. If their keeper hadn’t produced a couple of decent saves to deny Barlow and Hendo. If only Gilmour’s shot had hit the inside of the post and gone in instead of bouncing back off the keeper. If only Taryn had buried that free header. The ironic thing is that, with three minutes of stoppage time gone, we had a chance to really bore Spennymoor to death by the corner flag. For once we drove forward and smashed over the cross….. Random thoughts strike as well. I think Tobi was definitely missed down the right. If he was suspended for accumulating yellow cards I hope that one of them wasn’t for running off the pitch at Leamington! We’re critical of their second goal but the first equaliser was just as daft with possession needlessly conceded. And this keeper may be decent with the ball at his feet but has anyone actually seen him save a shot yet? I agree 100% with Fitzochris that recruitment needs to include a permanent keeper as well as the other positions that he mentions. There were two factors yesterday as well. One was the strong wind which no one else seems to have mentioned. The other is that we were, yet again, slow to get to second balls all over the pitch. A problem that needs addressing. How BJ lifts this team for Tuesday I don’t know. A major challenge. And I’ll be in the Sandy as usual on Saturday but I don’t expect more than 2000 other souls to bother. |
The strong wind was discussed on here pre-match Post-match? Nah... |  |
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FA Trophy semi on 10:53 - Apr 6 with 1374 views | Dale_4_Life | It is no easier to take on Sunday morning for me also.. firstly 442 is one of us and isn't the enemy, I agree with chunks of what he is trying to say.. The day started badly with the turnstile fiasco.. see the separate thread. The experiment of the drum and the singing section imploded they have to be back in the Sandy lane ASAP as Yoof who cannot behave are either aligned with or drawn towards this section of support. the full time scenes just unacceptable and disgraceful. Lifetime banning orders have to be issued to send the correct message. First half was a non event Dale not landing a blow and lucky not to be 0-1 down at half time. Improved second half but poor decision making by the team and an inability to see out a game raising its head for the umpteenth time this season. Two really poor goals to concede and why the keeper is not punching that cross clear 90+4 is a mystery. The header blazed over at 2-1 was as poor as the missed penalty. The stuttering 2 yard run up to make it 5-5 never filling me with any confidence. Can the players recover from that as there is one more shot left of glory this season? sadly not if the tactics and body language carry on from yesterday. This can work one of two ways, maybe we will see a reaction from the players on Tuesday but more importantly at home in front of 2000 on Saturday v Eastleigh. What a missed opportunity by the club off the pitch and the players on it. |  | |  |
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