| World Cup anyone? 16:59 - Jun 11 with 64964 views | Yorkshire_Dale |
With all the comings and goings and excitement at San Spotty,is anyone getting remotely interested in what is just about to start over the pond?
I think, looking at the England squad we have a really good chance.....there is a depth of talent without doubt.
Must say though I am not getting the purple haze about the competition and prefer to follow what's going on locally.
Just hope Haiti do well.
What do others think? |  | | |  |
| World Cup anyone? on 07:25 - Jun 24 with 3554 views | EllDale |
Two consecutive games where Gordon has failed to impose himself on things.
Barca fans may be wondering what all the fuss is about. | | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 08:40 - Jun 24 with 3430 views | TalkingSutty |
| World Cup anyone? on 07:12 - Jun 24 by isitme |
What can you do against a team who will sit deep and play on the break? We did not have enough quality to break them down. The left side was poor offensively with Gordon especially failing to impose himself. When Anderson came off in the second half we lacked direction. At times it was a bit like watching Dale against some of the more limited teams last season only in this case the goal I expected to come never did.
I suspect some changes for the next game. Rashford and Saka in for Gordon and Madueke. O'Reilly to start at left back and maybe a rest for Rice and James. Anderson, Bellingham and Rodgers can play in midfield and shift Spence over to right back. As long as we beat Panama by more than Ghana beat Croatia (if they do even beat them, which I am not sure they will) we will top the group and get a so called easier game in the last 32. |
I thought James had a shocker last night and Gordon didn't fancy it against a very physical Ghana team. Similarities with some of our performances last season and those before, dominated possesion but most of it spent passing the ball between each other in non threatening areas of the pitch. As the game starts to come to a conclusion we then introduce subs and start throwing crosses into the area and hopefully snatch a winner.
It doesn't matter who the manager is, there are certain ways of playing football that sucks the joy and excitement out of the game and last night was a reminder of that. There's no neccessity at all for fans to embrace it or agree with managers and pretend they enjoy watching backwards and sidewards football played at a snails pace, these modern day coaches havent reinvented the wheel. Poor teams are able to set up against this style of play and take superior opposition right to the very end of games. The fans have to suffer the frustration of watching it.
Last season McNulty found the X factor, he signed Mani D, he proved the difference and was too good for many defenders at National League level. It comes down to bringing tried and tested players into your club for the level you're playing at, they don't come cheap but they can be well worth the outlay especially in the final third of the pitch. |  | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 08:54 - Jun 24 with 3366 views | D_Alien |
| World Cup anyone? on 07:12 - Jun 24 by isitme |
What can you do against a team who will sit deep and play on the break? We did not have enough quality to break them down. The left side was poor offensively with Gordon especially failing to impose himself. When Anderson came off in the second half we lacked direction. At times it was a bit like watching Dale against some of the more limited teams last season only in this case the goal I expected to come never did.
I suspect some changes for the next game. Rashford and Saka in for Gordon and Madueke. O'Reilly to start at left back and maybe a rest for Rice and James. Anderson, Bellingham and Rodgers can play in midfield and shift Spence over to right back. As long as we beat Panama by more than Ghana beat Croatia (if they do even beat them, which I am not sure they will) we will top the group and get a so called easier game in the last 32. |
Agree about those changes
Rice in particular looks jaded after a campaign where he drove Arsenal to the title and CL final. He and Anderson too similar, a bit like the old Lampard and whatshisname conundrum
Rashford a class above Gordon, Saka still on the mend from an achilles problem but i think Tuchel has been starting with Gordon/Madueke at this stage to save the better wide men till deeper into the tournament
O'Reilly, yes, and offers a goal threat |  |
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| World Cup anyone? on 09:37 - Jun 24 with 3302 views | 49thseason |
| World Cup anyone? on 08:54 - Jun 24 by D_Alien |
Agree about those changes
Rice in particular looks jaded after a campaign where he drove Arsenal to the title and CL final. He and Anderson too similar, a bit like the old Lampard and whatshisname conundrum
Rashford a class above Gordon, Saka still on the mend from an achilles problem but i think Tuchel has been starting with Gordon/Madueke at this stage to save the better wide men till deeper into the tournament
O'Reilly, yes, and offers a goal threat |
Pedestrian .. no snap, no bite, a couple of presentable opportunities that would have been taken on any Saturday afternoon, but last nights team didn't seem to want to put themselves in the do or die positions..
The forwards were not getting any decent service for lack of movement and the distribution from the back when it did come was sloppy. Midfield was generally too deep.
I thought the referee was out of his depth too, lots of overly robust pushes and shoves that needed stopping early in the game but which went unpunished and gave Ghana the green light to keep doing them...
Still, a point is a point. |  | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 10:26 - Jun 24 with 3202 views | isitme |
| World Cup anyone? on 08:40 - Jun 24 by TalkingSutty |
I thought James had a shocker last night and Gordon didn't fancy it against a very physical Ghana team. Similarities with some of our performances last season and those before, dominated possesion but most of it spent passing the ball between each other in non threatening areas of the pitch. As the game starts to come to a conclusion we then introduce subs and start throwing crosses into the area and hopefully snatch a winner.
It doesn't matter who the manager is, there are certain ways of playing football that sucks the joy and excitement out of the game and last night was a reminder of that. There's no neccessity at all for fans to embrace it or agree with managers and pretend they enjoy watching backwards and sidewards football played at a snails pace, these modern day coaches havent reinvented the wheel. Poor teams are able to set up against this style of play and take superior opposition right to the very end of games. The fans have to suffer the frustration of watching it.
Last season McNulty found the X factor, he signed Mani D, he proved the difference and was too good for many defenders at National League level. It comes down to bringing tried and tested players into your club for the level you're playing at, they don't come cheap but they can be well worth the outlay especially in the final third of the pitch. |
How do you beat teams who play so defensively?
- Moments of individual skill.
- Good passing moves to break through the set defense.
- Quality set pieces.
- Attrition - bombard the box the crosses and hope one of them creates a chance.
We had no moments of individual skill and very few passing moves to break down the defence. We had two half chances from set pieces and no real volume of balls in the box, otherwise what a great performance. |  | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 11:30 - Jun 24 with 3100 views | TalkingSutty |
| World Cup anyone? on 10:26 - Jun 24 by isitme |
How do you beat teams who play so defensively?
- Moments of individual skill.
- Good passing moves to break through the set defense.
- Quality set pieces.
- Attrition - bombard the box the crosses and hope one of them creates a chance.
We had no moments of individual skill and very few passing moves to break down the defence. We had two half chances from set pieces and no real volume of balls in the box, otherwise what a great performance. |
The quality of set pieces and crossses into the box was very poor. The reluctance of players to drive forward with the ball when in posession, with acres of space in front of them. Their preference is to stop, put their foot on the ball and pass it sidewards or backwards, too structured and regimented. Lacking in bravery and passing the buck. There's no element of surprise or direct running into the heart of the opponents penalty area because they're frightened of losing the ball. The constant need to keep recycling it at the expense of getting half a yard on the full back and whipping in a early cross. While all of this is playing out in front of them the Ghanians are already in shape with all bases covered. Pace kills in football and it unlocks defences, casually passing the ball around to each other around the halfway line serves no purpose, even more so if your opponents aren't interested in engaging with you. | | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 11:53 - Jun 24 with 3052 views | D_Alien |
| World Cup anyone? on 11:30 - Jun 24 by TalkingSutty |
The quality of set pieces and crossses into the box was very poor. The reluctance of players to drive forward with the ball when in posession, with acres of space in front of them. Their preference is to stop, put their foot on the ball and pass it sidewards or backwards, too structured and regimented. Lacking in bravery and passing the buck. There's no element of surprise or direct running into the heart of the opponents penalty area because they're frightened of losing the ball. The constant need to keep recycling it at the expense of getting half a yard on the full back and whipping in a early cross. While all of this is playing out in front of them the Ghanians are already in shape with all bases covered. Pace kills in football and it unlocks defences, casually passing the ball around to each other around the halfway line serves no purpose, even more so if your opponents aren't interested in engaging with you. |
All of this is true. The one saving grace is that i honestly don't think Tuchel has been coaching them to play like that; more like the way we played against Croatia
Of course, most of the players know how to take the safe options, having had it drummed into them from an early age and when faced with the low block reverted to the option which would least make them look bad, i.e. losing the ball in a tackle, except they shouldn't feel that way about it if they've taken the chance to try and exploit an opening | |
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| World Cup anyone? on 12:05 - Jun 24 with 3037 views | wimborne_dale |
Thought Ghana did a great job. They set out to park the bus and catch us on the break and it almost worked.
There's a lot of talk about "should it have been a penalty?" Dunno but as Eze was clearly fouled at the start of the move, "Why weren't England given a free kick, left hand side attacking?" would be a more pertinent question.
BUT another thing, The incident when Pickford came to meet their onrushing No 25 and looked for all the world to have obstructed and brought him down, what can I say? That could so easily have been a free kick to Ghana (Alan Shearer thought so) and if had been, would the ref had to have sent Pickford off as their striker was otherwise clean through on goal? Did the ref bottle it? What do you think? |  |
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| World Cup anyone? on 12:58 - Jun 24 with 2960 views | TalkingSutty |
| World Cup anyone? on 11:53 - Jun 24 by D_Alien |
All of this is true. The one saving grace is that i honestly don't think Tuchel has been coaching them to play like that; more like the way we played against Croatia
Of course, most of the players know how to take the safe options, having had it drummed into them from an early age and when faced with the low block reverted to the option which would least make them look bad, i.e. losing the ball in a tackle, except they shouldn't feel that way about it if they've taken the chance to try and exploit an opening |
Exactly, Tuchel's response during the game was that of a very frustrated man. Throwing his hands up in the air at one point as Rice elected to turn back on his heels and pass backwards to James when Kane was waiting for him to deliver a cross. The object of the game is to get the ball into the danger areas and put it into your opponents net. At the end of the game we had completed not far off 800 passes without scoring a goal, i believe that's a record for the World Cup. It's nothing to be proud about but there will be some who will derive pleasure from watching what was essentially a training ground exercise in how to keep the ball with very little excitement involved. The most memorable goal i've seen watching Rochdale was Mani Ds at Wembley. A long desperate punt into the box and a striker who is good in the air doing what he does best. There's no 'best' way of playing football, mixing it up with pace and power, playing football in areas of the pitch designed to inflict the most damage on the opposition, in and around their penalty box. [Post edited 24 Jun 14:41]
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| World Cup anyone? on 15:45 - Jun 24 with 2743 views | Plattyswrinklynuts |
It seems that many of the teams playing a “low block” (defending deep in English) have actually done ok against the so called fancied sides. I wonder if Tuchels omission of Foden & Palmer might not come back to bite him in games to come.
Playing to a formula has been fashionable of late but I still think that you can’t legislate for game changing players who can play off the cuff & do the unexpected. From a Dale perspective you don’t need to look any further than Abdul Malik at Wembley.
Mavericks potentially change games. It’d be a shame if they were forced out by tactical dogma. |  | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 16:17 - Jun 24 with 2687 views | frenzied |
Mainoo would have been a decent substitution..good with the ball at his feet going at opposition players | | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 16:19 - Jun 24 with 2683 views | James1980 |
I saw a clip of a training drill on TikTok a while back. It was for a youth team and they were told they need to score but also make as many passes as they can the more passes before scoring the better | |
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| World Cup anyone? on 17:36 - Jun 24 with 2582 views | 442Dale |
BBC have an article analysing what England are trying to do tactically. Some of it could apply to most teams who favour an approach where they want to retain the ball as much as possible.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/fo |  |
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| World Cup anyone? on 18:05 - Jun 24 with 2519 views | TalkingSutty |
| World Cup anyone? on 17:36 - Jun 24 by 442Dale |
BBC have an article analysing what England are trying to do tactically. Some of it could apply to most teams who favour an approach where they want to retain the ball as much as possible.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/fo |
It's all getting a bit old hat though, there's nothing revolutionary about it. There's one big problem, what happens when your opponents refuse to play ball and come out to engage you? It makes you look daft because you end up passing the ball around on the halfway line while your opponents have had time to set their defensive block. We've even seen various central defenders at the Dale having more touches of the ball than any of their team mates. The same central defenders who are expected to play pin point passes up to the forward players because the opposotion refuse to leave their defensive low block. EEL, Hogan, Sassi, players who sometimes struggle to pass the ball from A to B are suddenly the main play makers in the team. It's rubbish to watch and just leaves most people in the stadium frustrated. | | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 23:21 - Jun 24 with 2320 views | Yorkshire_Dale |
Now, where have we seen quality passing at the back like Scotland are trying to play against Brazil tonight.....when will it stop? | | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 05:38 - Jun 25 with 2197 views | TalkingSutty |
| World Cup anyone? on 23:21 - Jun 24 by Yorkshire_Dale |
Now, where have we seen quality passing at the back like Scotland are trying to play against Brazil tonight.....when will it stop? |
Oi, stop it. Playing out from the back and throwing the game away is the future don't you know. It's in the manual so it must be right. To be fair, when we did it last season there were very few cock ups, a lot of teams didnt employ a high press though. Scotland are incapable of playing through Brazil, they don't have the skill set to do that against far superior opponents. Not just gifting one goal but very nearly two. Years of preperation and they just cut their own throat. Scotland have been very poor and negative in all three games, they were lucky to beat Haiti. [Post edited 25 Jun 5:41]
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| World Cup anyone? on 07:57 - Jun 25 with 2104 views | D_Alien |
| World Cup anyone? on 05:38 - Jun 25 by TalkingSutty |
Oi, stop it. Playing out from the back and throwing the game away is the future don't you know. It's in the manual so it must be right. To be fair, when we did it last season there were very few cock ups, a lot of teams didnt employ a high press though. Scotland are incapable of playing through Brazil, they don't have the skill set to do that against far superior opponents. Not just gifting one goal but very nearly two. Years of preperation and they just cut their own throat. Scotland have been very poor and negative in all three games, they were lucky to beat Haiti. [Post edited 25 Jun 5:41]
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For all the rewards of being a football player at a high level, Scott McKenna had that gut-wrenching look of having let his entire nation and its hordes of travelling fans down
Who could blame him for thinking "Which idiot of a coach insisted i hesitate and try to pick a pass right there?" | |
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| World Cup anyone? on 13:55 - Jun 25 with 1814 views | frenzied |
| World Cup anyone? on 07:57 - Jun 25 by D_Alien |
For all the rewards of being a football player at a high level, Scott McKenna had that gut-wrenching look of having let his entire nation and its hordes of travelling fans down
Who could blame him for thinking "Which idiot of a coach insisted i hesitate and try to pick a pass right there?" |
Even the best teams with the most skilled players will make a balls up playing like that..just gotta hope it’s when you are four nil up and not in a crucial World Cup game etc.
Coaches I guess look at the positive aspects of playing like that as opposed to the possibility of a costly mistake,
Gone are the days of the keeper hoofing the ball to the centre forward each time | | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 17:03 - Jun 25 with 1699 views | bluevein64 |
| World Cup anyone? on 23:21 - Jun 24 by Yorkshire_Dale |
Now, where have we seen quality passing at the back like Scotland are trying to play against Brazil tonight.....when will it stop? |
Now I realize why all those Scotland National squad spy's were at San Spotty home games season before last , Steve Clarke intended to set the World Cup alight with the Big Jim "Tippy Tappy Tripe" 6 yards box passing tactics all along ! |  | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 17:12 - Jun 25 with 1680 views | 442Dale |
| World Cup anyone? on 17:03 - Jun 25 by bluevein64 |
Now I realize why all those Scotland National squad spy's were at San Spotty home games season before last , Steve Clarke intended to set the World Cup alight with the Big Jim "Tippy Tappy Tripe" 6 yards box passing tactics all along ! |
A bloke as miserable and disrespectful as Clark wouldn’t have been able to evolve the tactic as effectively as we did over the last few campaigns anyway.
Absolutely crazy they extended his contract. | |
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| World Cup anyone? on 18:36 - Jun 25 with 1595 views | D_Alien |
| World Cup anyone? on 17:12 - Jun 25 by 442Dale |
A bloke as miserable and disrespectful as Clark wouldn’t have been able to evolve the tactic as effectively as we did over the last few campaigns anyway.
Absolutely crazy they extended his contract. |
A "dour Scot" no doubt, but he got them to the finals and gave them some hope
They've added $billions to the US economy with fans drinking the place dry, before the inevitable fall from a great height
Highly amusing!
Of course, they could still go through, but another aspect is fans hanging around (at huge expense) till Monday to find out... | |
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| World Cup anyone? on 19:06 - Jun 25 with 1558 views | frenzied |
| World Cup anyone? on 18:36 - Jun 25 by D_Alien |
A "dour Scot" no doubt, but he got them to the finals and gave them some hope
They've added $billions to the US economy with fans drinking the place dry, before the inevitable fall from a great height
Highly amusing!
Of course, they could still go through, but another aspect is fans hanging around (at huge expense) till Monday to find out... |
I think he’s done really well with what he has available..not had a real quality forward for years.
And..he’s already qualified for the next Euros in 2028. !!! | | | |
| World Cup anyone? on 19:50 - Jun 25 with 1527 views | 442Dale |
| World Cup anyone? on 19:06 - Jun 25 by frenzied |
I think he’s done really well with what he has available..not had a real quality forward for years.
And..he’s already qualified for the next Euros in 2028. !!! |
His attitude in interviews is terrible. Can only imagine what he’s like in a dressing room.
No doubt they did well to qualify but they’ve made little attempt to really win games at tournaments. | |
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| World Cup anyone? on 19:54 - Jun 25 with 1524 views | TVOS1907 |
| World Cup anyone? on 19:06 - Jun 25 by frenzied |
I think he’s done really well with what he has available..not had a real quality forward for years.
And..he’s already qualified for the next Euros in 2028. !!! |
He hasn't.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ |  |
| Maestro? No.
Elite? No.
Heavyweight poster? No.
Able to be rational and not over-react to individual results? Yes. |
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| World Cup anyone? on 20:34 - Jun 25 with 1492 views | D_Alien |
| World Cup anyone? on 19:50 - Jun 25 by 442Dale |
His attitude in interviews is terrible. Can only imagine what he’s like in a dressing room.
No doubt they did well to qualify but they’ve made little attempt to really win games at tournaments. |
Was JM a bundle of "laughs"?
Did he interview well?
Come on 442, credit where it's due, as you've tried to put across all season in a different arena | |
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