| Irish General Election 15:42 - Feb 9 with 16173 views | BrianMcCarthy |
Seismic shift to the left in Ireland today.
Exit polls suggesting that left parties are heading for 45% of the vote.
So many fascinating issues arising now:
Are Sinn Féin now on a par with the right-wing monoliths of Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael?
Will either of them get into coalition-bed with Sinn Féin?
Can Sinn Féin be trusted in Government?
Have Sinn Féin left violence behind?
Will Ireland, could Ireland, actually have a Left-Wing Government in the near future?
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| Irish General Election on 17:15 - Feb 9 with 1845 views | Boston |
Can't escape the irony here...how many Irish voters expressed concerns that Brexit would be a cause for a possible rise in terrorist activity. |  |
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| Irish General Election on 17:26 - Feb 9 with 1816 views | Gloucs_R |
| Irish General Election on 17:12 - Feb 9 by Paddyhoops |
Brian reckons people in Ireland would support a United Ireland . I'm not so sure
Are they ready for at least three generations of strife, violence and upheaval?
Unionists in the North won't lie down and take it like little lap dogs . Far from it.
Also will a united Ireland be able to support the security and cost implications of it? Debatable. Be careful what you wish for!! |
Wouldn't it make more sense to hold a referendum in the North? Leave, stay, independent? |  |
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| Irish General Election on 17:27 - Feb 9 with 1818 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Irish General Election on 17:12 - Feb 9 by Paddyhoops |
Brian reckons people in Ireland would support a United Ireland . I'm not so sure
Are they ready for at least three generations of strife, violence and upheaval?
Unionists in the North won't lie down and take it like little lap dogs . Far from it.
Also will a united Ireland be able to support the security and cost implications of it? Debatable. Be careful what you wish for!! |
I'm only reporting the results of polling on it.
I can't see that much violence in the event of a United Ireland. Some, naturally, but Unionists know it would be fruitless. Britain couldn't take them back even if they wanted to, and they don't since John Major's declaration prior to the Good Friday Agreement.
Crucially, of course, it can only happen if the South votes for it and it gets a majority of support from both the Northern Republicans *and* Northern Unionists. So the violence would only be in objection to something they themselves also voted for. | |
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| Irish General Election on 17:29 - Feb 9 with 1814 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Irish General Election on 17:15 - Feb 9 by Boston |
Can't escape the irony here...how many Irish voters expressed concerns that Brexit would be a cause for a possible rise in terrorist activity. |
I did, in the event of a hard border.
I'm not overly concened about Sinn Féin in the long run. We've been at peace for decades now and if there's any SF members involved in violence now it will drop off as they're subsumed into the political mainstream. | |
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| Irish General Election on 17:30 - Feb 9 with 1808 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Irish General Election on 17:26 - Feb 9 by Gloucs_R |
Wouldn't it make more sense to hold a referendum in the North? Leave, stay, independent? |
See my answer below, Gloucs. This is actually legislated for so you're right - that would have to happen first.
Independence is not an option in that legislation. | |
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| Irish General Election on 17:31 - Feb 9 with 1796 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Irish General Election on 17:12 - Feb 9 by MrSheen |
On reflection, it’s equally strange that anyone would trust Fianna Fáil to run a bath after Bertie Ahern. Did Sinn Féin decimate the various anti-austerity parties? And what about the Healy Rae brothers, will they have to get a proper job?
I didn’t realise until last week that a former Sinn Fein mayor of Belfast was one of the 72 people in the pub when Robert McCartney was killed who didn’t see anything. Are people really so stupid to think they could ever get Sinn Féin to give up power if they were ever voted in? [Post edited 9 Feb 2020 17:16]
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You think that Sinn Féin would hold on to power illegally? | |
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| Irish General Election on 17:32 - Feb 9 with 1793 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Irish General Election on 17:13 - Feb 9 by WatfordR |
Maybe you're right Brian. I wonder if SF might be happy to go again. The direction of travel seems to be with them, and it's probably unlikely they'd lose any votes? |
Good question. I wonder that as well. | |
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| Irish General Election on 17:35 - Feb 9 with 1788 views | MrSheen |
| Irish General Election on 17:31 - Feb 9 by BrianMcCarthy |
You think that Sinn Féin would hold on to power illegally? |
Yes, if they were able to take control of institutions, they would embed corruption and intimidation. |  | | |
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| Irish General Election on 17:42 - Feb 9 with 1775 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Irish General Election on 17:35 - Feb 9 by MrSheen |
Yes, if they were able to take control of institutions, they would embed corruption and intimidation. |
I can't see that happening in a million years. Just to be clear, I'm not a SF supporter so I'm not defending them. But that scenario is not one I'd worry about ever. | |
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| Irish General Election on 17:47 - Feb 9 with 1763 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Tá ár lá tagtha [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 21:38]
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| Irish General Election on 17:51 - Feb 9 with 1745 views | johncharles |
You've been reading the Sun again Sheenie |  |
| Strong and stable my arse. |
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| Irish General Election on 18:28 - Feb 9 with 1676 views | Jigsore |
| Irish General Election on 17:35 - Feb 9 by MrSheen |
Yes, if they were able to take control of institutions, they would embed corruption and intimidation. |
why would that happen then? there would at least be no more than any other party in power across these isles right now |  |
| “The thing about football - the important thing about football - is that it is not just about football.†|
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| Irish General Election on 19:00 - Feb 9 with 1628 views | MrSheen |
| Irish General Election on 17:51 - Feb 9 by johncharles |
You've been reading the Sun again Sheenie |
As I have been going to Ireland several times a year since about 1970, it’s based on a bit more than that. | | | |
| Irish General Election on 19:10 - Feb 9 with 1608 views | johncharles |
| Irish General Election on 19:00 - Feb 9 by MrSheen |
As I have been going to Ireland several times a year since about 1970, it’s based on a bit more than that. |
Eire is a lawful democratic and civilised modern country. A member of the EU and adheres to it’s rules and laws governing political parties and elections. Your post is insulting to Ireland and it’s people. | |
| Strong and stable my arse. |
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| Irish General Election on 19:16 - Feb 9 with 1591 views | MrSheen |
| Irish General Election on 19:10 - Feb 9 by johncharles |
Eire is a lawful democratic and civilised modern country. A member of the EU and adheres to it’s rules and laws governing political parties and elections. Your post is insulting to Ireland and it’s people. |
Simmer down, this isn’t Prime Minister’s questions. | | | |
| Irish General Election on 21:00 - Feb 9 with 1499 views | derbyhoop |
I get the impression that many voters have lost faith in FG to solve the domestic issues in Ireland. SF are no longer the bogeymen to the younger generation, although they may have made an error of judgement in not putting up enough candidates.
If exit polls are right then there will be a 3 way split. The horse trading to form a viable government should be interesting.
Brexit (a word I'm no longer allowed to use, apparently) may not have been an issue but, given how closely the Irish economy is tied to the UK, it will have an impact on the next Irish government.
I wouldn't be surprised if there was a border poll over a re-United Ireland, within the next 10 years but I wouldn't like to predict the outcome.
I'm speaking as the offspring of 2 Irish parents, and someone who spent 18 months working in Dublin, back in 2013/14. |  |
| Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop |
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| Irish General Election on 21:08 - Feb 9 with 1487 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Irish General Election on 21:00 - Feb 9 by derbyhoop |
I get the impression that many voters have lost faith in FG to solve the domestic issues in Ireland. SF are no longer the bogeymen to the younger generation, although they may have made an error of judgement in not putting up enough candidates.
If exit polls are right then there will be a 3 way split. The horse trading to form a viable government should be interesting.
Brexit (a word I'm no longer allowed to use, apparently) may not have been an issue but, given how closely the Irish economy is tied to the UK, it will have an impact on the next Irish government.
I wouldn't be surprised if there was a border poll over a re-United Ireland, within the next 10 years but I wouldn't like to predict the outcome.
I'm speaking as the offspring of 2 Irish parents, and someone who spent 18 months working in Dublin, back in 2013/14. |
Good post. Agree with all of that. | |
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| Irish General Election on 23:24 - Feb 9 with 1370 views | BrianMcCarthy |
Pleasingly, the far-right candidates are polling below 1% ,
Also, immigration was the most important factor for only 1% of the population.
This despite Ireland having one of the highest rates of inward migration in the World.
Not a bad day, all told. | |
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| Irish General Election on 23:33 - Feb 9 with 1355 views | robith |
| Irish General Election on 17:35 - Feb 9 by MrSheen |
Yes, if they were able to take control of institutions, they would embed corruption and intimidation. |
That is a farcical statement |  | | |
| Irish General Election on 00:10 - Feb 10 with 1321 views | SydneyRs |
| Irish General Election on 17:12 - Feb 9 by Paddyhoops |
Brian reckons people in Ireland would support a United Ireland . I'm not so sure
Are they ready for at least three generations of strife, violence and upheaval?
Unionists in the North won't lie down and take it like little lap dogs . Far from it.
Also will a united Ireland be able to support the security and cost implications of it? Debatable. Be careful what you wish for!! |
After centuries of opression and upheaval I think they can handle it. And I'm not sure it would come to that. The unioinist side would retain their current rights etc and could continue to lead the same lives.
On the Unionists, they have always preached democracy, will of the people type stuff while they had a strong majority in the north. Most of us want to be British so you should respect that was always their mantra. Surely they wouldn't resort to violence now that the demographincs are starting to work against them? And I'll wager they won't be treated like the catholics/repblicans were in the bad old days if it ever does happen.
Of course the unionists won't like it, but if the majotiy of the country wants it I don't care whether they like it or not, they should heed their own advice and accept whatever is democratically decided. Its finally starting to look like a united Ireland might be a possibility and the potential for a few bigots living in the past to kick off about it should not be a deterrent. The majority of them will be just fine, as the catholic side has been for some time now. [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 0:15]
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| Irish General Election on 01:08 - Feb 10 with 1283 views | Boston |
As a kid, I was informed by those with a better knowledge of Northern Ireland demographics that the Nationalist support would outnumber the Loyalists by 2030. I read last year that a steady trickle of immigration by the latter had speeded up this inevitability, maybe it's already the case?
But, a single nation on the island of Ireland there will be and unfortunately that will trigger some degree of 'terrorism' within the current boundaries of the Republic. Hopefully it will be short lived. [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 1:11]
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| Irish General Election on 08:20 - Feb 10 with 1148 views | Phildo |
| Irish General Election on 01:08 - Feb 10 by Boston |
As a kid, I was informed by those with a better knowledge of Northern Ireland demographics that the Nationalist support would outnumber the Loyalists by 2030. I read last year that a steady trickle of immigration by the latter had speeded up this inevitability, maybe it's already the case?
But, a single nation on the island of Ireland there will be and unfortunately that will trigger some degree of 'terrorism' within the current boundaries of the Republic. Hopefully it will be short lived. [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 1:11]
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I would say the long term challenge for unionism is not to entrench and try to hang on in the UK - it is to find an accommodation and constitutional role that allows it traditions to thrive in a united Ireland, and strategically to position themselves as the power-brokers in a new state.
One of my best mates is an Orange Order raised unionist from Co Down who has lived in Cork for the past 20 years and his main concern is finding a way for those in the north who identify as strongly loyalist to express that peacefully within the new Ireland.
Ironically FF and FG do still get identified around some of the mythology around the civil war but I guess that is increasingly irrelevant to younger voters. The same forces which have propelled SF in this election in the south saw them ironically lose 25% of the vote in the recent elections in the north. Whoever can harness a very new form of inclusive nationalism will be the long term winners out of all this. |  | | |
| Irish General Election on 09:05 - Feb 10 with 1111 views | IrishR |
Some interesting comments on here.
As someone from Cork who lives and works between Cork and Derry/Antrim the divide in people up here still is vast, Within a 500m drive from my house up here i will meet 6 Union Jacks and this is a predominately catholic town, these people will not go quietly. The hatred and divide is still part and parcel of daily life. The segregation and lack of integration even by the youngest of both sides is still very apparent. I was never here in the bad times but always feel a little tension in the air up north, maybe thats just me. To talk of a hassle free united Ireland however is very ambitious.
Similarly to the US and UK people wanted change and are tired of the old guard. The SF surge in the south is part due to change and part due to a romantic view of SF and a united Ireland. If there was a whole of Ireland referendum i have no doubt the result would be to unite but this would be made up of votes by many of my friends in Cork for example who share these romantic views yet have never stepped foot in the north nor will they after, they are having a say in something very alien to them, its an uneducated view and shows in the republican content they share around facebook etc but it is these people like my friends from Cork who would have a say on something they have never lived but listen to in Wolftones songs.
Very extreme views from yourself there MrSheen but cannot see that in the times we live in either, trying any of that would not only alienate Ireland from Europe but then alienate SF from the people again. Would most likely result then in history repeating itself and asking Britain for military assistance. | | | |
| Irish General Election on 09:06 - Feb 10 with 1106 views | runningman75 |
Going to be interesting when Ireland veto's any potential UK trade deal and Boris Johnson realises he has to get his head out of the sand regarding the Irish question. | | | |
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